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Comment by WheelsAtLarge | Hacker News Reader

What I don't get about fake meats is that they even exist. There is absolutely no reason why humans need to eat meat. 20+% of India's population is vegetarian and has been for generations. They have full lives without meat.

People don't have to be 100% vegetarians. The real game changer is to get the world's population to reduce their meat intake by eating more vegetarian meals. Vegetarian meals can be very tasty and satisfying. There's no need for synthetic meat.

Fake meats take a lot of resources. It's just another way to make a buck by getting people to consume something they don't need. In the same way, as soda is nice to have but you don't want to get behind it as a way to save the world. Fake meats are equivalent to snacks not world saviors.

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When you get time to read the article, you'll see that this point was addressed and that it turns out people won't change their behavior despite knowing for decades that meat can be cruel and terrible for the planet. You need to give people and easy low-friction alternative, and eating beans and rice in place of a juicy burger isn't going to cut it.

No, they aren't really addressing the point, they point out that eating more vegetables is better but they don't address the point that creating more satisfying dishes with out having to produce a super processed product that does not resemble a vegetable and requires so many resources is so much better than fake meats at any level.

Fake meat is green washing at its best.

Yes unprocessed vegetables are more sustainable than fake meat. The problem is that we as a society need to reduce the amount of meat that we eat. Fake meat is a drop-in replacement and is more sustainable. Your argument isn’t helping anything except for the meat industry.

It’s not a drop in replacement. It doesn’t taste like meat and it’s expensive.

Everyone I know has tried it and no one has replaced meat in their diet. I know some vegetarians who use them.

If we had a drop in, then I agree with you. But fake meats aren’t going to do it. I think it’s better to have more realistic health campaigns and subsidies.

I suspect this is just these new fake meat startups spending PR to get subsidies set up.

I mean it’s a drop in replacement in the way that an impossible burger easily replaces a beef patty, not that it’s a 1:1 replacement.

I would love better health campaigns and subsidies as well but no one wants be told to not eat meat or to lose the subsidies that make their meat cheap so it’s not going to happen.

Do you think that fake meat companies shouldn’t get subsidies?

People do change their behavior slowly.

That is why filming on factory farms and slaughterhouses is a jailable offense in Australia and why the meat industry spends billions on handouts worldwide.

Very simple changes like reducing meat in media, mandating a listed vegetarian option at restaraunts, forced transparency on the harms involved, and lowering the massive subsidies would reduce meat consumption considerably.

Or you could do the same thing that was done to almost completely stop the influx of new smokers. Lock the meat behind a cabinet out of sight and include a picture of the animal at the place and time of its death on the packaging.

Post-pandemic I think people are pretty tired of behavior change campaigns like these. What would you do about backlash or counter-movements?

There were numerous tantrums after the cigarettes. If you ignore them and the measures are only a mild inconvenience and you don't have to get people to do something actively they get tired of it and shut up

Humans like lots of luxuries that aren't required to survive. There's nothing special about meat in that sense.

> Vegetarian meals can be very tasty and satisfying.

As someone who grew up never eating a single piece of meat until about the age of 20, yes, but that's not the full picture.

After I started eating meat I ate pretty much ate the amount the average American does for about a decade. Nowadays I eat a lot less meat, and certainly don't require it every meal. I _can_ go a few days without it, but after that I get real cravings to the point that meals start to feel empty with out it. More so if I have been working out a lot.

Despite not eating meat for a few years now, I like the flavour of meat. So I personally welcome fake meats any time of the week, as long as they aren't prohibitly expensive to the environment.

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