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Comment by fudgefactorfive | Hacker News Reader

This is famously an issue with Rockstar style missions, they are so adherent to a script that even minor Playstyle variations lead to logical deadlocks. Red Dead 2 had the same issue, players finding paths to the door they know stuff is happening behind only for them to literally not function until an NPC points them out to you.

I want a world where I can figure out what to do next and that still functions, not one where Character X has to tell me to move to the next room for the doors to work as doors.

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This is pretty much what happens to a ton of games. It seems open, but you can’t do any creative solutions because it isn’t part of the design. Not saying it isn’t tough, but a company like Rockstar should have the ability to pull it off.

Just yesterday I learned that in Skyrim, there is a caretaker in the orphanage called Grelod the Kind, who is terrible to the children. So apparently if you are a pacifist, you can put a fear spell on her and she will run out the orphanage and she gets killed by a beggar there. That’s brilliant! It tells a story (beggar must have got her kid in) and it’s another way to solve the problem.

Exactly, it's worlds that aren't a sequence of stories but a mesh of relationships that seem much more alive.

I can obviously see how it's much harder to make a narrative state machine than a sequence of events with maybe a few branches, but still it's disappointing when huge budgets are spent on visuals alone with no good reason to examine them deeply.

Cough Cyberpunk 2077 Cough.

You want the original Deus Ex.

Ah, Ion Storm Austin (Deus Ex). And Looking Glass Studios (Thief).

We didn't know how far in the future we were living...

Haven't played it, but admittedly I've seen the Hbomberguy video on it and was really interested. Might take another look.

This wasn't always the case. Missions in GTA 3 - GTA SA were much more goal-focused, less scripted. You could approach them as you wanted to.

Have you ever played Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines?

I haven't actually but I've heard great things. I admit the setting isn't one I usually pursue, but I'll get over myself and take a look.

I think it's pretty much all open world games. As wide as the ocean but as deep as a puddle. Outside of the pre-scripted story you have basically no impact on the world as the player.

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