Hacker News Reader

Comment by deliriumchn | Hacker News Reader

This is very sad to read to be honest. My prof. was an old school guy who was author for few very in-depth books about organic chemistry.

He was very, very demanding and his class was very hard, our median scores were around 20-30% lower than in any other class, but in the end, I can def. say that after two years studying with that dude, it was my strongest subject, I could literally spit pages of text about anything in his exams in the end.

It was very hard, but it was very worth it and very fun to actually understand whats going on inside large chemical reactors.

Ofc, there are some teachers/professors that are making things too hard with no purpose (like robot-reading walls of text in a super speed mode and then demanding you to remember them on exam word by word), but some of them just have high standards and its a good thing

View on HN

Perhaps, but for most students the grade is the important benefit. An 'F' is a career-altering problem.

Early in my schooling I personally emphasized learning over grades and consistently encountered a high level of disapproval and administrative friction. The students who complained in this scenario aren't wrong, but it's the system that requires reform, not the professor.

And F doesn't have to be career altering if you retake the class. I get that it adds money/time/opportunity cost though.

The parent does raise the question of what is appropriate difficulty. Orgo should probably be difficult & rigorous for ChemE's, maybe less so for pre-meds. I think many schools have different course offerings for different majors for that reason.

In my school it seemed the thermodynamics prof would give a "gentleman's C" to the kids who tried somewhat, and an A to the ones who really put in the work.

> maybe less so for pre-meds

Yes, I agree that an industry that murders nearly a quarter million Americans annually through fully preventable medical errors needs to train their professionals to work with less rigor. YOLO, baby!

If you retake a class at NYU, your final grade on your GPA is the average of your attempts. So a F followed by an A is a C.

Is a C life and career altering? Maybe for some highly competitive paths like med school. And what if you got an F and then a B, not an A?

While at NYU, I failed a class. Then I retook it and got an A. The only major difference was that the first professor was extremely strict and demanding while the second professor was very laid back.

My low graduating GPA (which I take full responsibility for one way or another) haunted my career even as far as after 10 years of industry experience. Doors were closed or slammed shut because of it on more than a few instances - for example, I failed to acquire any internships at all because of GPA, and that subsequently made the search for my first full time job extremely painful.

An 'F' is a career-altering problem.

Are you forbidden from retaking the course/exam. If you get a C on your 3rd try, is that F still visible?

When I was at university you where in principle allowed to retake a course/exam as many times as you needed to pass.

The problem is that this class is frequently on the pre-med track, and a single F will tank your chances of getting into medical school, even if you retake the course and get an A.

The primary objective of students wanting to get into medical school is to get a high GPA, what specific courses they take and what they learned don't end up mattering at all. Very little of what they learn during the 4 years of undergrad will end up applying during medical school, residency, and their careers.

As someone above pointed out, this is indicative of a systemic issue and not just a problem with this particular professor.

At NYU, your grade for a class is the average of all the times you took a class. So your first F is very much reflected on your GPA.

Or at least that was the case when I was at NYU.

If you failed with an F, then retook it and got an A, your grade is C.

Now, other schools don’t necessarily follow this model.

> […] I could literally spit pages of text […]

Impressive, but probably figuratively or in a manner of speaking.

Literally can also mean figuratively, that debate's been over for a minute.

Literally declaring a winner and telling everyone to go home figuratively doesn't mean everyone quits playing.

My daily bread is literally implored

I have no barns nor granaries to hoard;

John Dryden, The Hind and The Panther (1687)

Every day with me is literally another yesterday for it is exactly the same.

Alexander Pope, Letter to H. Cromwell (March 1708)

His looks were very haggard, and his limbs and body literally worn to the bone

Charles Dickens, Nicholas Nickleby (1839)

If we were not perfectly convinced that Hamlet's Father died before the play began, there would be nothing more remarkable in his taking a stroll at night, in an easterly wind, upon his own ramparts, than there would be in any other middle-aged gentleman rashly turning out after dark in a breezy spot -- say Saint Paul's Churchyard for instance -- literally to astonish his son's weak mind.

Charles Dickens, A Christmas Carol (1843)

He is a fortunate man to be introduced to such a party of fine women at his arrival; it is literally to feed among the lilies.

Frances Brooke, The History of Emily Montague (1769)

I look upon it, Madam, to be one of the luckiest circumstances of my life, that I have this moment the honour of receiving your commands, and the satisfaction of confirming with my tongue, what my eyes perhaps have but too weakly expressed — that I am literally the humblest of your servants.

George Colman and David Garrick, The Clandestine Marriage (1766)

I'd very much believe that person could literally write pages on the topic.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com