Comment by luckylion | Hacker News Reader

Comment by luckylion | Hacker News Reader

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It's absurd to call capitalism the problem for e.g. pollution (which is a typical example of 'capitalism is the problem' statements), which every economic system faced (and the communist systems handled much worse than the capitalist), not to mention comparing slavery to 21st century employment in the West. The people uttering those statements know that, they're neither stupid nor children who haven't yet gotten an education, so they're lying, and they're doing so to manipulate.

A similar absurd lie that is intended to manipulate: Russia is being attacked by NATO and only defends itself against the fascists in Ukraine.

> It's self evident that there should be separate standards for that.

Sure, but they shouldn't be based on whether something is true or wrong, absurd or plausible, or said with intent to manipulate or inform.

Better criteria are required, or we'll be back to Twitter's stance of "this instance is against TOS, and that same thing isn't, because we feel like the author didn't mean it the same way", which comes down to "there are no rules other than don't do something/be someone I dislike".

Pollution is an example of an externality which unregulated <anything>ism fails to address, but since capitalism is the dominant economic model and many capitalists advocate for less regulation, it’s not a dramatic leap of logic to say capitalism is the problem.

Again, we've had something very not capitalist to compare it to (which those people tend to love) and boy, was that worse.

But the past tends to be forgotten and on the internet nobody knows that the Soviet Union existed, so why not claim that it didn't. Or that it does, but is being attacked by NATO. Or, my favorite, that Russia doesn't exist, but is just a mirage used by NATO countries to pretend there's an external enemy so their population will follow orders more easily. "It's just an opinion" after all.

This is just a classic straw man, because people don’t typically believe that. Or a red herring, because that’s not really the point.

No one here is suggesting that the Soviet Union has a good track record on pollution. People are suggesting that capitalism doesn’t. “Capitalism is the problem” does not imply that the Soviet Union is the solution.

When people say “capitalism is the problem,” they’re often looking towards an ideal — which sometimes exists and sometimes doesn’t — of a better world. That’s not a bad thing. Practically no one would suggest that an authoritarian flavor of communism (ala USSR) is that ideal.

The US was the only country to decrease emissions over the decades while growing our energy output, all countries in the Paris Climate Accord failed to do so.

We did it because of fracking nat. gas replacing coal due to innovation. Capitalism brings a lot of innovation including advancements in green energy too.

Tesla was able to economically compete and take a huge segment away from the automobile giants through capitalism, forcing them to compete and develop EV cars.

I don't see many socialist countries actually doing much, hell Germany still wanted Russian gas so much someone (wonder who) had to blow up the pipeline!

Since the first sentence is an outright fabrication, I don't hold much hope the rest is any better.

https://www.ecosystemmarketplace.com/articles/21-countries-r...

Learn to read. I said reducing emissions while growing ENERGY OUTPUT. Not GDP.

Of course GDP grew for all countries over a decade, if it's not that means your country is doing worse than inflation rates lol.

European countries energy output shrank due to outsourcing their energy to places like Russia (something that recently just bit them in the ass)

The statement "capitalism is the problem" can be saying that capitalism is the problem with respect to a more regulated for of capitalism, Nordic socialism, or even a platonic ideal/imaginary version of communism.

Saying that Ukraine is the aggressor in the current war is a much more specific factual claim (that is absolutely a lie).

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