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Comment by hklgny | Hacker News Reader

Everyone likes to blame the server interface, but honestly that's not so bad and I think most people get over it.

Mastodon's real problem in my opinion is that its primary audience today doesn't actually want anyone new to join - it's VERY toxic for newcomers who don't fit a specific mold. It's a shame, cause we really do need something new.

I'm hoping some of the new decentralized ones take off.

Edit: I think the comment about this being survivor bias is fair, but I still believe the community itself is a bigger hurdle for Mastodon than the signup flow

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I'm pretty technical, but neither of those were the reasons I quickly abandoned Mastodon.

I don't care about federation, and I want algorithmic discovery. Specific I want to follow all sorts of people from around the world (on multiple mastodon servers) and have more people suggested to me based on that. Mastodon can't even reliably search across servers.

This is survivor bias. If you're a non-tech person signing up for a new service, the federation aspect is just wizard talk and it's not obvious what difference it makes. Most people do not want to go on side quests to find other people they know or figure out which digital village they live in, especially not as the first stage in the onboarding process.

Fair point, then I guess I'd adjust my comment to say "in ADDITION to the server issue....".

The reality is even once you're connected, it can be a rough place to explore for newcomers.

People manage to deal with this when they sign up for their email account. It's just that we don't (yet) have the equivalent of gmail (or hotmail, aol before that) as a default option.

I understand the hesitancy in some respects. Longtime Mastodon users fear a mass migration of the toxic elements of Twitter into what has been their private sphere. If Mastodon becomes Twitter 2.0 then we have solved nothing.

It's a well-founded concern, too. Every new wave has a cacophony of people demanding it change to work exactly like Twitter so they don't have to learn anything new or change, dooming them to experience exactly what they left if they got their way.

It reminds me of how Metro Atlanta has grown. People move out a bit to get away from Atlanta traffic. Then they miss all the stuff they had in Atlanta, and start clamoring for all they miss from where they moved from. It often starts with a Target or a movie theater. Ten years on, they're complaining about Atlanta traffic again, and they move. And the cycle repeats until half of North Georgia is consumed by a web of crumbling asphalt roads dangling off packed highways.

The difference here is Mastodon, as a community, said "No. Learn a new way or buzz off." Most people buzz off, and occasionally complain about how hostile the community was to them to anyone who'll listen. Some people stick around and appreciate the different way of doing things. Repeat.

I don't agree with this take - I joined mastodon with the best intentions and really wish I could have found my folks there. I did not want it to be like Twitter.

The challenge is that it's intentionally difficult to find your community on there unless you're invited in from an existing connection outside of Mastodon. I understand that's how some people want it - but blaming users for not understanding how to "learn a new way" in the first place IS hostile - whether you want to hear it or not.

Ultimately, doesn't matter. Mastodon will be what it will be, and folks like me will find something else that's a little more welcoming to people who aren't quite as my-tribe-only focused.

>> "I don't agree with this take - I joined mastodon with the best intentions and really wish I could have found my folks there. I did not want it to be like Twitter."

Then you're not who I'm referring to.

I looked at joining Mastodon.

The first "recommended" server on the Mastodon's official website was something about anime, and the second seemed to be about some "Queer friendly furry community", whatever that means. Then there was one about tech and and the local Bay Area one.

At least, unlike GNU Ring (or whatever it's called nowadays) it didn't just crash on startup.

Twitter has always been a cesspool. You're fighting not only other people but also the algorithm / popularity contest. I actually hate it and never want to go back, but for some it's engaging. People probably don't use Mastodon just cause nobody they care about is on it and the whole multi-instance thing is weird.

That hasn't been my experience. I joined a couple months ago and I have yet to see a single instance of toxicity in my feeds or replies. But I am guessing it greatly depends on the type of groups and content you interact with.

The great thing about Mastodon is that it doesn't push anything in my face that I didn't subscribe to.

> it's VERY toxic for newcomers who don't fit a specific mold.

I have not experienced that ... at all. Surely this is highly instance dependent.

Have you considered you fit the mold?

I have considered that I don't fit most molds, but I am very observant.

I could believe that it's possible to stumble upon an instance that fits who you are and offers a great onboarding experience - but it's far from the norm.

The reason I'm confident saying that is that it's actually by design for the platform. The community is very hostile towards any kind of discovery tools or enhancements that help you explore the network without a direct introduction. Any attempt to provide that functionality is blasted with an intense amount of aggression and shut down.

That can be fine if they don't want to be Twitter. But I don't take it seriously as a Twitter replacement.

Which instance is nice?

Most people do not get over it.

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