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Comment by can16358p | Hacker News Reader

Great. "Let's make our children much less tech-savvy in this world where importance of tech skills is skyrocketing, just because we can't be bothered to parent them well so they turn to tablets and phones for entertainment."

Absolutely terrible move. Good that it's voluntary.

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Maybe you missed all the previous articles on HN about how the latest generations are less technically literate, unable to navigate file systems, unable to use regular PC applications (only knowing smartphone versions), and generally only knowing how to stay within the locked down walls of modern smartphone ecosystems.

> unable to navigate file systems

In 5 years I'd assume that skill will be completely obsolete for "normal" people.

Heck even as a programmer I loathe navigating files and am searching everything as much as I can. Sure some kids will need to learn about file systems as they grow up, just as some of us learned how boot loaders work or how CPU are architected. But I wouldn't put that as mandatory literacy even today.

> regular PC applications

Looking at the latest developments from Apple and Microsoft, I don't see "regular" PC applications staying much different from phone/tablets one for much longer either.

I generally find those article to make no sense.

My mother, in the mid 90s, could just barely use a computer to type something up in Word and print it out. She was just sorta starting to grasp email by 2000. Even some kids I knew in middle and high school had trouble with the basics of navigating around a Mac and using a web browser. Go back to the late 80s when my dad brought home the first computer I got to use, and most of my schoolmates had never even seen one, let alone knew how to use one.

I absolutely agree that the locked down environments we have today are awful and counter-productive. But my nephew could scroll through YouTube Kids on a tablet when he was three years old and start the videos he wanted to watch, and go back to find something else when he was tired of it. Three years old! Now, at seven, even though he can't always read everything, he can operate fairly complex apps.

I guess it depends on how you define "technical literacy". I look at it more as "being able to successfully navigate the technology of the time", not so much "be a hacker", which seems to be what some people try to push it to be.

I think ui is like a language that you need to read to be able to navigate software. My experience is that many older people learn to use software by rote and can't read the UI well. Even quite technically skilled people. But my niece could read a UI from a young age and is more able to figure stuff out. And young people are more willing to use the UI hints that older people avoid (like a ribbon on word).

I don’t see file systems remaining for anyone outside techies within 5 years. Even now, unless the system wants a file in a particular place, I just save it wherever and conduct a search.

Even as a dev, I can’t say I really know how to use the file system on Mac as I have only owned Mac computers since search became zippy and all development work happens inside an IDE.

Kids don’t know how to use a file system as the speed of search has rendered day to day use of the file system mostly irrelevant.

PC applications are also increasingly disappearing. Things are done on the web (even many “desktop” apps are just the site in an Electron instance) or on the phone.

Not having access to the most ubiquitous device to access the web means being able to get less information about tech.

Ridiculous strawman argument, smartphones —are not— synonymous with all technology. You can educate children in different types of technology and yet also not give them unfettered access to smartphones.

Ridiculous strawman argument, smartphones are the easiest and most convenient way of accessing information. A ban on them is a big block on informational freedom.

Couldn’t agree more. The older generation didn’t go to school in a world with Google, and they dont’t understand what technology prohibition does to kids. I’ve gone to school with people who weren’t allowed access to technology. Saying it puts them at a disadvantage is an understatement.

Technical literacy needs to be cultivated. We should be teaching kids to use technology productively, not banning it.

I'd argue that modern devices and their OS + touch only interfaces engender tech skill attrition more so than anything that went before.

Smartphone ban, not technology ban.

If you think using a phone makes one "tech savvy", you aren't very "tech savvy".

Using a phone enables access to information, which can make a person tech savvy.

The decision to ban smartphones generally comes from a weighing of the benefit of the information they provide access to versus the damage phone usage causes to childrens’ psyche.

Is there information to further this desired information that can't be accessed from a £400 laptop or pc?

I've been coding for over 30 years. I don't recall using a phone to bring up an API document

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