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Comment by idiotsecant | Hacker News Reader

Ok, let's say your dog is well behaved. I think we can agree that lots of other people who think that their dog is well behaved actually have a dog that is potentially dangerous. How am I supposed to know by looking at you and your dog which it is? So now I get to feel in danger so that you can feel slightly more at home.

How does that make sense?

This is an excellent example of 'ridiculous government overreach' that actually makes perfect sense and some people just don't like.

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>How does that make sense?

In a word: discernment. If it's a miniature poodle, you can probably chill. If it's a big dog, it's probably worthwhile to enforce the law.

It actually is a pretty good example of overreach insofar as you're advocating the removal of any judgement call from the equation. That is the surest way to build a relentless bureaucratic machine that makes everyone miserable without actually protecting anyone.

The human in the loop is a feature, not a bug.

because if there's one thing lapdogs are known for, it's a lack of violence.

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/shortcuts/2021/may/...

Now consider why it is you didn't know this?

You are reasoning in terms of total elimination of risk. That is the source of our disagreement.

I was pointing out your discernment of lapdogs is completely off base from reality, undermining your own point.

You respond with a strawman.

If just seeing a dog without a leash is enough for you to feel in danger you probably shouldn't leave your home, let alone go to the park. That aside, you don't have a right to not feel in danger. You don't even have a right to not be in danger, though you do have a right to not be put in danger deliberately or by negligence.

If they feel threatened by dogs off leashes, that's them, let them live. It seems perfectly reasonable for such a person to go someplace where dogs must be on leashes.

I'm not saying they shouldn't live, I'm saying that if off-leash dogs scare you and you don't want to be scared, you shouldn't be outside. Even if every last dog owner kept their dog on a leash at all times, there would still be some dogs without a leash, and all of them would be outside your house. I assume any person would understand that by the time they reach adulthood and either learn to deal with the fact that some dogs they run into won't have a leash, or they stop going outside if they can't deal with it. Stubbornly refusing to accept reality is childish.

you've never actually been threatened by a dog off a leash have you?

I never understood why my high school buddy was so afraid of dogs. I would tease him sometimes because when he saw a large dog, even on a leash, he would edge to the other side of me and act nervous. He's a big and typically brave dude so it was out of character. Plus I just never had a concept of dogs as dangerous based on my childhood experiences.

He eventually explained that he grew up in the poor neighborhood, where people keep large, poorly trained "guard dogs" that occasionally escape and roam the streets. As a child he had to evade roaming dogs several times, including one occasion where he genuinely believes he was running for his life. Apparently it fucked him up pretty badly. Poorly trained dogs (especially those that are bread for aggression) are no joke, even to full grown adults.

Not that I can remember. Therefore...? What's your point?

knowing vs understanding.

Telling people who have different life experiences and tolerances for risk than you to "stop going outside" is childish, my dude. You seem to struggle with accepting the reality of this person's differing worldview. Maybe take a step back and realize that it's perfectly ok when people disagree with you about stuff on the internet.

I struggle to understand how an adult does not realize that leading a normal life requires taking in some amount of risk, unless the person has some kind of learning difficulty. If you want to go outside, there is a non-zero chance that you'll be mauled by a dog without a leash. There's a much greater chance that you'll be involved in a car accident, and cars are policed much more strictly than dog leashes, not to mention that violations are punished much more severely.

>Maybe take a step back and realize that it's perfectly ok when people disagree with you about stuff on the internet.

Exactly what of what I said implies that I have a problem with disagreeing with people? All I said was "if you do these two things, your behavior is incongruous". That's as politely as I can disagree with someone. Maybe your problem is that I said anything at all, in which case I think you're the one who has a problem with disagreement.

> If you want to go outside, there is a non-zero chance that you'll be mauled by a dog without a leash.

That risk lessens significantly if dogs are mandated to be leashed.

unleashed dogs are regularly picked up by the city and if they're not claimed by someone w/i a specific amount of time, they're euthanised.

This isn't actually helping your case.

Dogs are already mandated to be leashed. That doesn't mean they will be leashed. That's my point.

perfect is the enemy of good.

We shouldn't outlaw murder because some people will murder anyway. We shouldn't outlaw rape because some people will rape anyway.

You have no leg to stand on here, you're grasping at straws.

Back in the days people used to shoot any predator in sight, a leash is just a civilized measure that makes everyone happy, but the old way is fine too with me :)

You're making some wild extrapolations here. Have you ever watched your dog be mauled to death violently, literally ripped to pieces by another animal off it's leash that is 'harmless and just playing'? Have you ever tried to unclamp an attacking 'playful' dog that someone didn't feel the need to leash from the broken, panicked, dying husk of something that minutes before was an animal you loved?

If not, I'd be careful with how loudly you proclaim ignorant opinions without consideration for people who might have a wider experience than you. Wisdom is knowing when to shut up and listen, sometimes.

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