Hacker News Reader

Comment by graphe | Hacker News Reader

Apple works unless you need something specific that every other devices supports but apple doesn't.

I've never had a great experience with any laptop but at least I can't say I didn't get screwed on the price most of the time (non apple times). Who remembers how apple didn't admit or fix the Nvidia GPU on their laptop for years but it was easy to just get a new ipod?

View on HN

That nVidia GPU issue was a design flaw on nVidia's part that nVidia refused to take responsibility for.

The problem is that normal use and wear and tear over time would lead to the GPU physically failing, leading to a non-bootable system and necessitating a whole new logic board.

Apple had a long standing special service program of covering (very expensive) logic board replacements for all of those MacBook Pros that were usually well out of of warranty¹ because Apple gave a damn about making it right whereas nVidia refused to even acknowledge the issue.

Source: I was a Mac Genius at an Apple Store from 2008 to 2013.

1) https://www.macrumors.com/2017/05/20/apple-ends-2011-macbook...

Apple was supposed to vet them. I expect that answer from razer.

Only took a few years for them to admit it failed under normal use, by that time it was long outdated. I don't pretend waiting at the apple store is a luxury anymore. The brand is tainted to me.

Dell, HP, and Compaq were also affected by the issue. The issue was with the die packaging, nearly impossible to catch post-production.

https://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2010/10/nvidia-settle...

I’m not going to universally defend Apple (because no one can) but when you have to go back 10 years to come up with an example that as other commenters have noted was a supplier issue it’s not as strong an argument as you may think.

It was my last relationship with a new Mac, and it will remain that way. Why you want to attack my experience I'm uncertain.

I'm not attacking your experience, in the end you got burnt by this (regardless of who was at fault) and that was your experience. That's fair.

That said, as other commenters have noted it wasn't an Apple issue. Nvidia shirked responsibility and Apple stepped up. This is one of the examples where Apple has earned their reputation for user experience and overall "premium" brand halo. They took the loss and replaced any failures related to this fiasco for six years - well beyond the standard warranty period.

In another comment I noted my very poor experience with Framework. It was so bad I basically do what you do and trash them at every opportunity - to me they deserve it. You obviously feel the same way from your Apple experience. The difference is in my case they took no responsibility whatsoever and I'm left with a nearly-useless $3k machine. That's buying first gen hardware from a startup for you, and I should have known better. You bought hardware from a leading and well established brand where this never should have happened. That's far worse.

I mentioned the ten years because a decade in the life of a tech company that has sold billions of devices across multiple product lines and generations in the meantime is (in my mind) a pretty weak argument and borderline irrational stance. You're holding on to a decade old grudge against a brand that has famously happy, dedicated, and loyal users. Apple isn't the most valuable company in the world because your experience is anywhere near typical.

I would hope that in ten years time (or sooner) I will have gotten over my issues with Framework (if they're still around) and would be willing to try them again. I guess we'll see if I'm able to let it go by then.

Apple made a bad computer by using components that were known to break down. Nvidia GPUs on mobile still break that way, and have broken in gaming laptops all the time. It took years for them to admit fault, by that time the computer was worthless. My friends Intel MacBook was good at first and it got worst and worst, he was glad he got applecare. His m1 Mac is doing great, but I'd call the quality closer to the consumer electronic I mentioned earlier. I've had other used MacBooks and laptops since, but apples customer service had gotten worst and there's long waits. If he didn't have apple care for the Intel one he would have hated his Mac too.

Framework is probably not going to be around in less than 10 years. I'm happy some products but not the Apple company. Waiting for hours to be sent away at the apple store is never a luxury and a dreadful experience.

> components that were known to break down

If this was as obvious and well-known as you make it seem it boggles the mind how a primarily hardware company like Apple missed this. I suspect hindsight is 20/20 here. I also have two Nvidia Apple Intel Macbooks (one of which lives in my trunk) that weren't bit by this. Anecdotes, you know.

> My friends Intel MacBook was good at first and it got worst and worst

I'm sitting next to my 2013 Mac Book that I still use daily for occasional testing. The thing just won't die or give me any issues. Anecdotes.

> Waiting for hours to be sent away at the apple store is never a luxury and a dreadful experience.

They at least have the Apple Store available (show me another consumer hardware manufacturer that has anything similar), and needless to say your experiences (again) don't match mine. I've been to multiple Apple Stores in multiple states time and time again and never experienced this. The last time I was at their EXTREMELY busy store on Michigan Ave in Chicago I was in and out inside of 15 minutes. They just handed me a brand new Apple Watch (no AppleCare even) and offered to set it up for me (declined).

I'm not sure what's going on in your world but my social circle is almost exclusively iMessage-blue and I've never heard anything like this. Quite the contrary, actually, and reflective of their overall great reputation for customer service and support.

Dedicated GPUs break on gaming laptops and do often. It's not unknown, apple underclocked it after to prevent it happening again. I love my Apple electronics but their Intel laptops sucked for me.

Now that you mention it, I had a bad experience with their batteries dying in the cold for a while, and luckily I had applecare and it took mutiple geniuses to decide it was a problem even though the problem was known.

It's funny, when I was in Chicago the Michigan one was always AWFUL for me (never helped, swamped with people, appointments were hard to come by) and the one by the Northside was awesome and much better with CS. Maybe management changed, but it's at best inconsistent with our experiences. The times I went in, I heard tons of other people with the same failures I had, some were sent away and some were helped.

How many times did you go to get problems fixed?

Reply on news.ycombinator.com