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Comment by dogma1138 | Hacker News Reader

These cards are not a valid form of ID in the UK, you can’t open a bank account with a biometric permit. If you are a foreigner on a visa you have to use your passport to open a bank account, all the card does is prove that you have temporary or permanent leave to remain.

They currently have absolutely no use other than border control.

Source: I have one.

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You need your passport if you've only got a vignette or in-passport visa sticker.

BRP is often accepted, in lieu of driving license for bank account opening. https://www.lloydsbank.com/legal/proof-of-identity.html

I wouldn't call it a "not valid form of ID," when you can use them to board domestic flights, prove your age at establishments, and practically use it as an ID where they'd otherwise accept a driving license for ID.

PS: I hold one too.

If you look at Lloyd’s under the actual documents accepted they don’t list it there.

They even state that: “The Biometric Residence Permit card may not be accepted in all our online journeys. You may need to provide additional documentation.”

Both HSBC and Barclays don’t accept them, not even to pick up a card from a branch.

EU identity cards are accepted but UK BRP and BRCs aren’t https://noidnosale.com/acceptable-forms-of-id-in-the-uk

If you managed to use yours for anything other than border control then it’s because whoever inspected it didn’t knew the rules.

Good point, rather interesting they state "in all our online journeys," rather than in-person.

Anytime I've had to verify identity online for bank account opening, it entailed taking a photo of my ID which then goes through automated ID checks via Jumio or similar APIs.

regulator KYC guidelines are general and require firms to check the identity of their potential clients without specifying exactly how

it's up to the service/goods provider what documents they accept which vary in terms of risk tolerance

In the UK a standard account (and many other services) is a legal right, as such the guidelines are quite specific.

GOV.UK seems conflicted about it lol "You usually do not need a BRP to open a bank account. Contact the bank to check if you’ll need a BRP or if you can use a different document." https://www.gov.uk/biometric-residence-permits/prove-your-st...

"The biometric residence permit is proof of the holder’s right to stay, work or study in the UK. It can also be used as a form of identification (for example, if they wish to open a bank account in the UK). https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/...

:')

> temporary or permanent leave to remain.

Off-topic but non-native speakers must find this phrase so confusing the first time they see it.

It's actually called "indefinite leave to remain", which almost sounds as if they hadn't made their mind up about leave vs remain.

I'm glad they renamed it to "settled status" for EU citizens remaining after the UK decided to leave the EU.

They didn’t rename it to “settled status”, those are two separate things.

Settled and pre-settled status is used exclusively by the EU Settlement Scheme and refers to the 5 year requirement (pre-settled) for EU citizens wanting to apply.

I know, but it's similar and they could have chosen a similar name.

For any non-native speaker who’s confused, leave can mean the same thing as permission, which is how it’s being used here.

Just to further this who are still confused as to how tf leave became permission. It's a very British thing, I would hazard it might also be specifically English. I grew up in Scotland and we did use it, but I was in a border town, I would be surprised if it's used in Glasgow or Edinburgh (could be wrong) - it comes from the permission to not be at something. I would get "leave from school" meaning I had permission not to be at school, same thing for work. In my opinion, it's basically slang, I'm surprised to see it in official documents (so I guess it's not technically slang).

It didn't become, it had a sense of permission for a while

https://www.etymonline.com/word/leave

French has the same dual meaning in the verb laisser. It can be used when departing, or allowing. No idea if other Romance languages are similar.

I'd hazard that it came into English from French, or maybe the other way around.

Apparently some German in there too.

Etymology From Old French lesser, lessier, laissier (“to let, let go, leave”), from Latin laxō, laxāre (“to relax, loosen”); partly from or influenced by Old High German lāzan (“to let, let go, leave”) (German lassen), from Proto-West Germanic *lātan (“to let, leave, leave alone”).

I can't find anything about it and I've been poking around for the better part of 20 minutes, but my presumption would be this comes from Royal Court, to take leave of the court or the presence of the Royal estate? I'm guessing you would be granted permission to take your leave > take leave > permission. Total guess, however. Who knew leave could be so fun. ;)

Do you have annual leave from work in Scotland? Or is it called something else?

You know I've been thinking about this leave thing for over an hour now - it's got me super curious for some reason. I think there is a class thing here as well? I never ever heard anyone say that, take holiday, take time, take off, but take leave... it would sound very posh and jarring to hear someone say that, the only time I can think of was a friend who boarded in England and he took annual leave from boarding school (that's what originally made me think it's an English thing) - Fact is however, I have no idea what I'm talking about and could be writing fan fiction here. Maybe I've found my PhD, ha.

> non-native speakers must find this phrase so confusing

Even native speakers struggle with it (i.e. me, when I first saw it being used).

'Leave' in its form meaning 'permission' is only generally used in 'I am on leave from work today'. Many other Commonwealth and Anglophone countries (Australia, NZ, Canada, Singapore) just call it a 'visa validity period'; indefinite leave to remain is 'permanent residency'.

In the UK, at least, they don't call it "permanent residency" because it can be revoked quite easily. The "leave to remain" part is implying that one can stay in the country until further notice but does not imply a right to residence. Spend too long abroad over a period of a few years and there's a requirement to "reapply" which may or not be successful.

> Spend too long abroad over a period of a few years and there's a requirement to "reapply"

This applies to many other countries' so-called permanent residencies as well. It could be revoked if one spends a long period abroad, or collects a (local or foreign) criminal record, or otherwise gets in the granting government's bad books. They're permanent only in name.

Same in the US. As a green card holder, I cannot leave the U.S. for more than a year. If I do, I lose my permanent resident status.

My wife is Russian. This card (from another country) is what allowed her to retain bank accounts at various different institutions.

The "from another country" part is the important differentiator. I'd bet she opened the bank accounts in question outside the UK too?

Note that we're not living in the UK, but in Austria. But she had to use her Austrian card in Banks from other countries to demonstrate that she's settled. In our case Estonia, UK and Germany.

An EEA identity card is not the same as cards issued by the home office and ironically it’s a valid form of primary (class 1) ID in the UK.

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