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Comment by DrBazza | Hacker News Reader

BBC version of same article - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-68518623

> An estimated 500,000 trees are in the UK compared to 80,000 in California.

> To assess how these towering giants are adapting to their UK home, scientists selected a sample of nearly 5,000 trees to study at Wakehurst, Benmore Botanic Garden in Argyllshire, Scotland and Havering Country Park in Essex.

> However, while the trees are doing well in the UK, there's little chance of them taking over our native forests any time soon - they're not reproducing here as they need very specific conditions to take seed.

I'm curious about the final statement - the article goes to great lengths to emphasize the similarity in conditions, so I wonder what would be missing that would prevent sequoias from reproducing. And to quote a phrase 'life, uh, finds a way'.

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"the seeds only being able to grow successfully in full sun and in mineral-rich soils, free from competing vegetation. Although the seeds can germinate in moist needle humus in the spring, these seedlings will die as the duff dries in the summer. They therefore require periodic wildfire to clear competing vegetation and soil humus before successful regeneration can occur" (Wikipedia)

They need fire and sun. (And maybe also cold winters). Britain does not have that.

me m8 dave can provide the fire so long as the old bill doesn't find out about it (lad's on magistrate's orders to not have matches)

OI wherz ur matches loicense!?

You don't need a license for matches. They're not even age-restricted! https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-154040...

> these seedlings will die as the duff dries in the summer

Again the myth of Prometheus, "they need fire, burn, burn, burn"... Yawn.

may die --On California-- UK is a little more humid.

Sequoiadendron grows happy in most temperate areas, including most of Spain. Segovia has some of the tallest trees out of USA, and is a hot place on summer. We have also a few small Sequioadendron forests on the North of Spain since 1950 or even in Granada since 1870. Some Sequioa sempervirens live even in Jaen

(and they don't need fire at all, because gardeners do all the work of taking care for the saplings).

Side note, but the Sugi tree of Japan is perhaps the most similar tree to the Sequoia in terms of appearance.

Do these redwoods in Spain also reproduce naturally?

That would depend much more on cattle and lawnmowers than on fires. But it does not matter, because we don't need to wait for the natural spreading of the seeds.

We can plant any tree that we need, were we need it. And we, for sure, will need a lot in the near future.

After all, we put any road that we need where we need it. It was not an obstacle for the last 200 years, so all is needed is the political will to do the same with forests.

Well, there used to be 6 trillion trees on earth and today there are only 3 trillion left. Planting 3 trillion trees manually is certainly a lot more work then allowing them to reproduce exponentially.

But much more efficient and with much faster grow.

The sooner 8 trillion people start planting 3 trillion trees, the better. My quote is filled. Your turn.

I've always found the idea that a tree that lives for 2000 years "needs" fire for reproduction on human timescales dubious.

The places these trees grow naturally are not naturally fire prone. Go look at any lightning strike map.

forrest fires are not actually that uncommon, and contrary to what some agenda pushers say, they are not caused by climate change. a great many are by arsonists (of which the media then ignores), and the rest happens naturally. Due to poor forrest management (of preventing smaller fires), it then turns into megafires

perhaps the seedlings can be cultivated manually then, until they can survive without intervention - then they should last a long time.

Well yeah, I mean that's nothing new - it's called a tree nursery. But, as the BBC article states, the chances of them reproducing in the wild are slim...

If we've learned anything from Jurassic Park, it's that life...finds a way

I think that's the point of this post. They're manually cared for until they survive but they don't have to worry about them reproducing. Kind of a nice feature!

I hate when they do apples and oranges comparisons; it renders it almost useless:

"There are an estimated half a million redwoods in the UK... fewer than 80,000 giant sequoias remaining in their native California range."

generic redwoods in UK 500,000, specific giant sequoias in Calif 80,000. It does not say how many specific giant sequoias there are in the UK.

It also doesn’t say how many giant sequoias are in CA. They do grow when planted in CA as well outside their native range. The native giant sequoias live on a tiny fraction of CA’s area, maybe 1%.

Interesting. I've seen the ones at Wakehurst, a lot were lost during the 1987 hurricane.

I wouldn't worry about rogue trees, pretty much all UK forest is to some extent "curated", even the historic old growth places. And they're not exactly hard to see.

They require wild fires to reproduce: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sequoiadendron_giganteum

The Wikipedia page says that in the wild they usually require wildfires to clear the land and allow the sequoias' seeds to germinates, and the seeds are also fussy:

"Although the seeds can germinate in moist needle humus in the spring, these seedlings will die as the duff dries in the summer. They therefore require periodic wildfire to clear competing vegetation and soil humus before successful regeneration can occur. Without fire, shade-loving species will crowd out young sequoia seedlings, and sequoia seeds will not germinate". [1]

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sequoiadendron_giganteum

There have to be more than 80k in the US. Maybe they're just counting mature large trees? The groves are full of saplings and "teenagers".

Also, does this mean that all the 500k trees have been planted?

3128 hectares were planted with trees in UK just last year. Remember that trees are a crop, and most forests in Europe are plantations.

https://forestrycommission.blog.gov.uk/2023/06/16/england-tr...

Trees are a crop, but the very slow growing sequoias are more of a status symbol (as the article also mentions). And not only in the UK, many parks, botanical gardens etc. all over Europe just have to have at least one sequoia...

but the number quoted for the UK includes the costal redwood, which IS one of the most popular farmed woods.

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