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Comment by jylam | Hacker News Reader

"Everything from Grain de Sail brand fine chocolates and organic coffee to cosmetic products, wine, and French fashion house luxury goods were on board."

So luxury stuff that no one really needs to get from the other side of the world. There is nothing environmentally friendly about useless stuff shipped from a country 10.000km away. Cocoa and coffee obviously doesn't grow in France, so it already came for somewhere else very far away. Cosmetic products are either a scam or available locally, those are chemicals or plants that don't grow in France.

“We must change our mindset to products that last longer and generate less pressure on the environment.” Yes, so no luxury goods across the oceans. More local stuff.

That's textbook greenwashing. (full disclosure, I'm French, never seen a cocoa or coffee or cosmetic plant grow here)

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You think luxury goods are the problem?

Theres 8 billion of us... Most of the population eats based on imports.

China, a billion people, only produces 60 percent of its own food. Africa, large portions of the Middle East survive on imported grain. Hell what started out as aid to Nigeria is now a delicacy and part of the culture: stock fish. An African nation identifies part of its culture with a Norwegian export.

This isnt a "rich" problem the system is fucked from tip to tail. EVERYTHING needs to change, and we can do that now and figure out a way that is "fair" or we can just wait till it's fucked, and then famine and war solve the problem.

I was tracking with you till the last sentence - why is this bad? I tend to think it's a good thing that 40% of Chinese people (580 million people) aren't starving. Britain hasn't been able to feed itself from domestic agriculture for 200+ years, would you have their population halved so that they don't need food imports anymore? I don't understand.

Hasn't been able or hasn't been trying? I reeeaally doubt that the UK couldn't produce enough if they tried, they just don't because it is more expensive.

> Cocoa and coffee obviously doesn't grow in France, so it already came for somewhere else very far away.

From the article:

> After the ship leaves New York City on April 15, 2024, Grain de Sail ll will return to France, loaded with various goods. This is the first load of many for the Grain de Sail ll. In total, this vessel plans to sail the seas five times a year, trekking from France to New York and then down through the Caribbean, where the sailboat will dispatch humanitarian aid, working alongside local NGOs. The sailboat will also restock its coffee and cacao supply on its journey through the Caribbean. That supply is then brought back across the sea to France, where the coffee is roasted, and fine chocolates are produced.

You can find more details on their site: https://graindesail-overseas.com/q-a

Almost nothing is entirely local. Even with foodstuffs, fertilizer feed and other supplies has to be transported from great distances. Whether something gets to its destination in a less energy-intensive way locally depends on the product. Plus it's more land-efficient (and therefore less hard on environment) for farmers to sell to a wider area.

You can of course give up luxuries if you want, but it's a pointless race to the bottom. Emissions go up because demand goes up in the developing world, not because you ordered coffee and chocolate. And of course that surge in demand is a reflection of an improved quality of life, i.e. living more like the West.

Since climate change is a short-run imminent problem, I agree that interventions of some sort alongside the innovation race are warranted. Here though, some are more impactful and politically viable than others. There is some low hanging fruit that governments can take advantage of, such as green grants for improving home insulation, dissuading purchase of SUVs (the gas-powered ones), greatly improving public transportation and zoning reform, etc.

Yes, the greenest luxury good is the one which is not consumed. The second greenest luxury good is the one made with supply chains close to home.

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