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Comment by sandworm101 | Hacker News Reader

And this is deep into "sport climbing", borderline gym rat territory imho. It doesn't model all the other core aspects such as protection, rope management, exposure and rest stops. I imaging if you pointed this at a real cliff and recorded several assents it would quickly become a blurry-twitchy mess as all the movements not touching the rock spoiled the data. Maybe for bouldering, but not for real climbing.

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What makes rope climbing "real"?

There are lots more variables to consider, particularly in lead climbing, even when you have a bolted route. And trad climbing is even more complex than that.

Trad lead is climbing. Basically everything else is some sort of simulation.

It's 2024 and some people are gonna gatekeep that if you're not shoving cams in some bigwall granite, it's not climbing?

Such differences are actually at the heart of climbing. Is taking a helicopter up to the top climbing? Of course not. So from day one it is not about getting to the top but about following invented rules governing how you get to the top. How about a bolted-on ladder? Or pre-placed protection (bolts)? Clean trad, leaving the rock as you found it, is generally seen as the highest form.

(Climbing rock without ropes may be more "pure" but is so dangerous that it should never be idolized.)

Cams? Real climbers use stones wrapped with hawser!

This one-upmanship is very much part of climbing culture. From the top down, the hierarchy is: free soloists (climbing at height without any protection), trad climbers (carry the rope up with them, set their own protection), sports lead climbers (carry the rope up with them, bolts are set into the wall), top rope climbers (rope already there dangling from the top). Right down the bottom, you have aid climbing, when you use equipment to haul yourself up on a rope.

And then there's indoors vs. outdoors, with some dedicated outdoor climbers regarding anything done in a climbing gym as "not real climbing".

Most people don't take this literally, and it's generally considered to be a standing joke in climbing. Sadly, though, some people take it very seriously.

Aid climbing isn't respected on smaller or well-established cliffs, but most understand that it has a place. All the great routes started as aid routes, only being climbed "free" years later. Aid is also a very useful skill in the rain or rescue situations when friction disappears.

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