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Comment by poundy | Hacker News Reader

Dr. Temple Grandin, an adult with autism who became a successful engineer, academic and speaker, believes that her disorder is an asset. She once famously called NASA a sheltered workshop for people with autism and Asperger Syndrome. She believes that people with autistic spectrum disorders are the great innovators, and "if the world was left to you socialites, nothing would get done and we would still be in caves talking to each other."

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I'm not a fan of this quote. It really does dismiss the arts, the power of socializing, society, government, and largely the human experience.

I'm much, much closer in mentality to Temple and to be frank, her strawman socialite is weak sauce. I've spent much of my adulthood learning social skills I never picked up as a child or teenager and they in themselves have an incredible amount of power. Without the socialites we wouldn't have gotten on the moon because we'd be too busy in our basements making toothpick replicas of various Lord of The Ring battles. Honestly, NASA is a pretty poor example. The amount of politicking, career maneuvering, inter department competition, giant egos, public policy changes, new administrations, etc going on there would be unbearable to someone like Grandin.

Different evolutionary neurotypical strategies exist because they have value. One isn't "better" than another. Let's stop playing this game and accept that from a macro view there's a lot going on and its unfair to piss on or put one group on a pedestal. Its just too easy to do so. Ease and psychologically pleasing conclusions should always be seen with a critical eye.

I think this is also why extremist right-wing politics appeals to the geeky crowd. We like simple answers that rely on systems (free markets, no taxes) and don't understand how the social aspects (regulation, control, subsidizing for the poor) matter. To many they're just roadblocks to some idealized system that 'must work' because it makes sense on paper in a very simple way.

Oh well, here come the downvotes, but I really wish on a personal level that my own issues were addressed when I was younger. I learned long ago that, yes, I'm smart and creative and am able to do difficult things, but the price for that for a long time was misery, loneliness, confusion, and depression. I know its a cliche but the balanced really life is the best life. I don't want to be Temple Grandin the same way I don't want to be Paris Hilton. I wouldn't mind being Temple Hilton though.

There are a lot of people, on Slashdot in particular, and also here, who have self-diagnosed themselves with Asperger's in the belief that it makes them Homo Superior.

Yuuup.

I'm always amused at the predictable trajectory of the comments on any sort of HN posting about Asperger's. In almost all cases, a disproportionate number of the people who comment or read the comments have Asperger's themselves, or at least think they do.

One of them will post this Temple Grandin quote or something along similar lines extolling the technical problem-solving superiority of people with Asperger's, with or without realizing how inflammatory it is.

Someone will point out how insulting it is to technical problem-solvers without Asperger's and to human beings in general, who typically feel pretty bad when they're confronted with what's basically an assertion that nobody like them has ever contributed to the progress of the human race.

That person will immediately be downvoted into oblivion because there are some elements in the tone of his comment that result in it being perceived as an insult in its own right.

>In almost all cases, a disproportionate number of the people who comment or read the comments have Asperger's themselves, or at least think they do.

So why is that? Does HN (and tech in general) attract people with a specific mental makeup, or does it attract a lot of liars?

There are Walter Mitty's in every walk of life.

Agree that it sometimes appears to be that some feel it makes them superior. But could also be for the same reason that people get a rise out of being a bad boy/girl and not just ordinary. Off the top another example of this is someone saying it's good to have a special needs child because it makes them a better person. Or how having cancer was a good thing. I'm sure someone can find the appropriate psychological principle that I am referring to. (Not talking about rationalization.)

People is not either autistic or socialite. Following the same (rhetoric) logic, "if the world was left to you autistic, humanity would extinguish in two generations tops".

I'm sure the special needs teachers who made that possible, and the taxpayers who fund them, are delighted to hear that. Maybe the socialites would still be in caves, but the "aspies" would be outside starving.

The symptoms of Asberger's are so indistinguishable from "being a dick" that they might as well be synonymous.

Your post angers and insults me. Everything you said is negative and mean, while the original poster was at least trying to add to the conversation. Even calling those with Asperger's "aspies" is condescending.

My point addressed the individual the parent quoted, who seems completely dismissive of the massive support structure created around her, by people she holds in contempt, that she calls "socialites". She claims that people without Aspergers are incapable of innovating, which is clearly arrogant nonsense.

People find their place in the world. I cannot imagine being dyslexic or unable to empathize with people. It's inspiring that people can turn those "handicaps" into competitive advantages.

While the comment wasn't very sensitive, it also happens to be true. Our society tries to build a support structure around folks to enable them to reach their potential. Sometimes we're successful, other times we're not successful. In the past, unless your family was able to help you find a place, folks with mental problems were basically discarded by society.

"Our society tries to build a support structure around folks to enable them to reach their potential."

I would argue most of the success is due to coping mechanisms developed by people than societal support structure. In fact, the free markets probably have more to do with their success than society.

NASA isn't a product of the free market, except in the sense that that "socialites" who work in the free market pay their taxes so Dr Temple can sneer at them from her ivory tower.

NASA is hardly typical of employers, and the free market is not the sole origin of value. Perhaps you are taking a tongue-in-cheek remark a little too personally. It's a big world, and it has room for some generally anti-social loners as well.

"Even calling those with Asperger's "aspies" is condescending."

Why? Are you claiming that using "aspies" is an "a" word?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asperger_syndrome

"People identifying with Asperger syndrome may refer to themselves in casual conversation as aspies (a term first used in print by Liane Holliday Willey in 1999)."

About Liane:

http://www.psychologytoday.com/experts/liane-holliday-willey...

You're getting downvoted, but not being told why.

Asperger's is a lot more complex than just "being a dick". Unfortunately some people use it as an excuse for undesirable behaviors. Regardless, that does not extend to all sufferers. Sometimes it manifests as intense, uncontrollable interest in certain narrow topics and a sensitivity to certain sounds, foods, smells, etc, and a shy or awkward disposition. That isn't being a dick by any means.

I'm sorry if you had a bad experience. It may stem from the fact if you've interacted with people who were diagnosed at a young age, they tend to be on the very far end of the spectrum and as a result may exhibit more extreme symptoms. There are a lot of people who have Asperger's who simply don't disclose it and have developed coping mechanisms that help them blend in. There might be many around you, but they might never have come out as such.

> You're getting downvoted, but not being told why.

That's also a great way to describe the social aspects of mild[1] Asperger's: afflicted individuals are ignored, bullied, and excluded. No one tells them why this is happening, they're expected to "just get it", and it's assumed that they're making a deliberate choice to "be a dick".

[1] Severe Asperger's is much worse, e.g., you are a brilliant programmer but you're living in an institution as your family is unable to take care of you and you are simply unable to function on your own; this is an actual case I am aware of, not an imagined scenario.

You have sufficient social acumen to understand that this comment is critical of you. Many people with Asperger's don't.

Everyone is the hero of their own personal narrative.

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