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Comment by moandcompany | Hacker News Reader

On a past trip to Paris and Florence, I wondered why there were so many non-tourist Chinese living in the region. It turns out... Many of those "Made in Italy" luxury goods are made by skilled Chinese artisans (in Italy).

The value of those "brands" are based on perception and the existing brands have put a lot of work into cultivating their brands historically.

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/04/16/the-chinese-wo...

https://forum.purseblog.com/threads/inexpensive-immigrant-la...

On a side note, this also applies to some "Made in America" brands too. Some of my favorite American brands used to host factory tours for their customers -- they tended to have a majority if not all southeast/east Asian workers making their garments and bags.

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Also interestingly Italy was basically the 2nd country hit with a massive spike in Covid cases right when the pandemic hit, as there had been some leather/fabric trade show with participants flying to and fro (I don't recall the specifics)

I remember reading it was "undocumented" Chinese nationals who were traveling back and forth between China and Italy. One of Italy's largest textile factories is literally within miles of the Wuhan lab and many speculated that many of the workers were moving back and forth and brought the virus from the factory to Italy.

But you are correct in the fact there is no denying Italy was hit very early on, well before many realized what was going on. I remember seeing an article were Italian doctors were concerned they had five deaths in a single weekend from new strain of influenza they hadn't seen before.

Prato, just outside Florence, "is home to the largest Chinese community in Italy and one of the largest in Europe (...) the medieval Tuscan town of 195,000 counts around 12% of its residents as Chinese—though undocumented residents are suspected to bump the percentage up much higher" (to quote the first result I found on google search)

The rabbit hole of Chinese and Italy goes even deeper. They go gaga about Italy, at least Chinese women. I've listened to two Chinese women go on and on how Italy has a culture similar to Chinese etc. Prato is the tip of the iceberg if you ask me.

Are you saying that people living in America who (or whose parents) were born in China wouldn't be American?

The description of "non-tourist" Chinese is intended to describe persons that are of Chinese ancestry, and in these contexts, more likely than not, immigrants from China now living-in, and/or working-in a different nation, for example, France, Italy, or the United States; their (primary) purpose for physically being there is not tourism/leisure/recreation.

No, a person living in America who was born in China, or whose parents were born in China, could self-identify or be identified as Chinese, American, both (e.g. "Chinese-American"), neither, or something else entirely.

I think the implication is that these are people who trained in their home countries and were brought to Italy so the luxury brands could continue claiming a "rich history of Italian craftsmanship." In a way it's true but it's also lying by omission.

Yes. There's also an interesting tangential topic of so-called "counterfeit" or "replica" luxury goods where they can sometimes be unofficial items produced from the exact same factory, in-country, or abroad as "extra-runs", as well as items produced by those "skilled artisans" that previously worked at the official factories recreating the same items, using the same methods and materials, unofficially elsewhere.

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