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it is not of unknown value. in fact, they are valued as you have to pay taxes from it

I'm from Europe. I don't have to pay taxes from RSUs before I have actually sold the stock, even if it's vested and neither do I have to pay any taxes on options until I have made actual profit from them.

But yes, I do wonder if it will direct a lot of negotiations into the more "benefits" section of the thing.

Interesting, obviously I must be in other EU country, or laws have changed, but here it was mandatory to pay taxes from vested RSUs.

At the point of vesting and at what price point? Price at vesting?

The original thread was about options, not RSUs. Not sure if it makes a difference.

Does your country not tax unrealised capital gains? Or fictional gains? Mine does.

they have a paper value, it's not unknown, it's listed on the 409A. it's just that there isn't a free market for those shares.

My understanding is startups try to minimize 409A value as much as possible while staying within IRS rules. The market value of options, if it were possible to sell them on the open market, would be higher.

I don’t know what the equivalent concept is in EU countries (or if there even is one).

Have to say so in the job ad.