Congress hears testimony on aliens | Hacker News Reader

Congress hears testimony on aliens

theregister.com

18 pointsrbanffy73 comments

a POSIWID view of this is that these "government reveals UAP secrets" stories always seems like a way to issue an interrupt and neutralize volatility in another mainstream story by redirecting attention to it. it's a popular distraction tactic with a lever attached to it. a hearing like this only takes a few days to a couple of weeks to schedule and arrange, and time spent mulling the story is time not spent on the present issues. UAPs aren't secret, it's a managed narrative.

we don't need official disclosures to have serious conversations about consequences, meaning, and what we can learn from the fact of being observed. the best are probably already elaborated in fiction, notably in the star trek franchise regarding the species wide and civilizational reorientation impacts of first contact.

if anything, the need for these performative hearings indicates how far off human civilization is from an official first contact, (I would estimate at least another century or more) because they exist to nudge a very long tail of people who are psychologically and culturally unprepared for it. by unprepared, I mean their strategy for negotiating in the world will revert to a zero sum material nihilism, like that of an animal or less than human, instead of elevate their perspective to an infinite sum openness to the possibilities of a nagivable universe.

in other words, it's a way to wag the dog and deflect attention.

Lauren Bobert gets up in front of the country during a conspiracy theory session and says dumb shit, and the news runs with it.

meanwhile Trump is actively plotting to shoe-horn foreign assets into intelligence roles, fire most generals, and generally enact revenge -- Bobo is just a distracting to make sure that happens with less optics.

I'm not sure the existing cliches cover it. There is a way to look at these disclosures based on their effects and consequences. it breaks up some of the post election momentum with a base who loves this stuff and neutralizes them from acting (on what I don't know). it's a way to change the subject.

the next couple of years are going to be amazing for UAP watchers anyway, I'd predict it's going to be one of to go-to cards the bureaucracy has left to play in response to popular scrutiny of their value.

Surely if there's good evidence we can do better than testimony. Otherwise this is just a distraction wasting everyone's time. Who cares?!

The issue, allegedly, is that any such evidence is classified. So presently it only could be disclosed to those with sufficient clearance. And while I'd love for us all to see it, I don't think this topic can be written off just because we're not seeing close-up 4K footage yet.

These are reputable ex-govt officials (except Schellenberger) that are testifying under oath to Congress. If they're caught lying, they can go to prison. I understand that human testimony is not very good scientific evidence, but considering the circumstances, I see enough reason for Congress to at least take their claims seriously and investigate them to the fullest extent possible.

And if the government is openly investigating UFOs, I'm certainly interested in that. Either it's true, and it's the biggest story in the history of mankind, or it's a psy-op, and also a huge story of intentional misdirection and lies. But tbh if you follow the lore, there's a solid chance that what they're saying is true.

The title is edited to be more clickbait than the actual article title.

I also find it amusing that Russia, China, EU and the US fought wars, proxies, engage in espionage and were very close to global nuclear war on a few occasions. But they always have the unwavering commitment to hide any evidence about aliens /s. Among generations and different leaderships without doubt.

After all, people believe China and the Soviet Union colluded with the USA during deepest Cold War to hide evidence that the Moon landings were fake. It actually makes more sense if you believe that aliens must be part of that deal somehow.

Everything is aliens, except hiding the aliens which is just Deep State and Trump+Musk can solve it tomorrow.

If you start with an assumption that "alien threat comes above all else" then I can imagine building a conspiracy case on top of that with governments that hate each other but hold hands when it comes to hiding/countering that threat.

Like any other argument or reasoning, it's as strong as its weakest link, or the foundation it's built on.

If we assume that most governments, not only the one in the White House, are under control of reptilians, it is not far fetched.

And until we run out of bubble gum, there is no way out of it.

I'm feeling lately like I'm about to run out of bubble gum.

The US could have done with about 74 million pairs of special sunglasses last month

76,068,135 To be exact.

Actually if we're practical about it 6 million would probably have been enough.

House and senate aren’t quite ideal right now.

...What proof do you have that anything outside of the US exists?

I thought I went to Germany once, but now I'm questioning if they didn't just fly me over the Great Lakes and show me around PA

I am not a number! I am a free man!

As a Swede, I have pondered over something similar. Nobody I have ever met have been in USA. It's obviously a satire made up by illuminati to enrage the masses while they dismantle the welfare system /s

something something illuminati something

I figured the model was that they're all keeping it secret for competitive reasons, especially if they're all trying to derive tech from it. Maybe if you admit aliens are real, the public demands you show off the resulting new toys, and the skunkworks types don't like that. Especially if they're not actually ready.

What surprises me is that how, in a social media-driven world starved for original content, that countries whose cybersecurity policy is a chicken wire fence can keep such massive programs secret.

Aliens are totally real: https://xkcd.com/2572/

Ok, we s/the government hides//'d the title above.

> Evidence for the above was offered by four so-called whistleblowers who claimed the US government actively covered up evidence.

Was it these guys: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lone_Gunmen ?

In the same way that viruses can randomly embed themselves into human DNA, memes can randomly embed themselves into our social DNA. This is a prime example.

Doesn't work because memes don't have their own locomotion. Meme distribution and embed is not random, they're consciously promoted at some point by someone.

The initial definition of a meme by Richard Dawkins (believe it or not) says precisely this.

> "conveys the idea of a unit of cultural transmission, or a unit of imitation".

Nothing like wasting time and getting a nice pay check for it.

How about spending time on fixing issues that will affect US Citizens. Like funding for Social Security and Medicare ?

Oh wait, that means they will actually have to think about real world problems instead of sitting, drinking coffee and asking people dumb questions no one cares about.

The universe is 13.8 billion years old. The JWST has found galaxies formed just 400 million years after the Big Bang. It took the earth 4.6 billion years to form, and 1 billion years to create life.

Our best theory of the universe, General Relativity, has solutions that allow for faster-than-light travel via some Alcubierre type drive (some [without negative mass](https://arxiv.org/abs/2405.02709)), and even wormholes.

Even with newtonian mechanic style solutions, it's estimated that it would only take Von Neumann self-replicating probes about 100k years to traverse our own galaxy.

Is it really that unlikely that some non-human intelligence potentially *billions* of years more advanced than us found our planet and uses it to study us or for whatever other purposes to them? IMO no.

And if you would do any research beyond just the headlines, you might come to the realization that our probably has government has recovered crashed/landed NHI craft.

I'm happy to point you to some not-so-light reading if you want to have a real conversation about this.

I would be interested in the references to read please.

You can start with this bill that Senate Majority Leader Schumer and Senator Mike Rounds put out this year (and last year) https://www.congress.gov/118/crec/2024/07/11/170/115/CREC-20...

I have to get started with work, but I will come back and give you all the links I have once I get home to my personal laptop.

Oh come on. That's not anything.

I'll be here waiting for actual links, please.

I apologize, I just had surgery a few days ago. My recovery isn't going as quickly as planned..

Now, I still recommend reading that proposed legislation because it sets the context up for these other links.

* Loose Threads PDF https://www.docdroid.net/3sZ9MaI/loose-threads-pdf (very, very long read) * Ratcliffe July 2023 https://twitter.com/highpeaks77/status/1685669297308282881 * Ratcliffe January 2023 https://twitter.com/UAPJames/status/1614644671589892101 * Ratcliffe June 2021 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPDeuy_YSs0 * HOC Hearing July 26, 2023 https://www.youtube.com/live/SNgoul4vyDM?si=oBkDt3j63uDL63Tr * HOC Hearing Nov 13, 2024 https://www.c-span.org/video/?539937-1/hearing-unidentified-...

Especially ones not written in crayon.

> Is it really that unlikely that some non-human intelligence potentially billions of years more advanced than us

I think there's a fine-tuning problem with that kind of argument. You have to believe all the steps that make intelligent space-faring life elsewhere come into being, and yet only one other manages to do so. If there were more than one, then it seems to me the same argument about government conspiracies would apply: every single one of them would have to work very hard to hide any evidence of their existence - not just from our mobile phones, but our most advanced telescopes.

I think if there were others close enough to matter, we'd have been colonised by an errant Von Neumann machine by now.

> You have to believe all the steps that make intelligent space-faring life elsewhere come into being

I would argue that it's very selfish thinking we would be the only intelligent life in the universe, let alone our own galaxy. If you're throwing out the entire argument based on that presumption, then this conversation is pointless.

Science is about optimism to learn what we don't know. There are things in the sky that we can't identify, as Obama has said https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1hNYs55sqs We should be open to the idea of all possibilities, rather than dousing fire on it.

you only read half the argument.

Why would some Von Newman probes colonize us instead of just observing?

    ------> Point
    ---> You

> I think if there were others close enough to matter, we'd have been colonised by an errant Von Neumann machine by now.

As long as were exploring wild theories, how about this one: Aliens smarter than us have colonized earth and are manipulating our information sources so we are not aware. Further, every once in a while they "give" us discoveries to advance our technology in a controlled manner. Perhaps we're captives in what is equivalent to a zoo.

I find that more pleasant to imagine than aggressive/hostile aliens that could probably destroy our civilization in about 17 seconds, though that would have the benefit of solving all of our problems in one fell swoop.

I already thought of that one - bacteria and fungi are their compute substrate for their immaterial cities. (ref: diaspora by Greg Egan, and surface detail by Ian M. Banks).

>it seems to me the same argument about government conspiracies would apply: every single one of them would have to work very hard to hide any evidence of their existence - not just from our mobile phones, but our most advanced telescopes.

https://www.vice.com/en/article/how-and-why-the-fbi-mysterio...

While your questions is interesting, it is not related to the news being discussed, which is about if USA is covering up details about aliens.

I feel most intelligent people understand there's life elsewhere in the universe.

Also, people don't automatically assume said life come here and visit us all of the time just because they presumably exist.

It's not automatically assumed, and that's the conversation we're trying to change.

A civilisation billions of years more advanced than us should surely be putting out some sort of signal, intentionally or not, that they exist, right? And yet we've never seen any kind of signal like that. Space is incomprehensibly large and empty, and while I also absolutely believe that there is some other kind of life in the universe, the fact that we've never detected any means they've probably never detected us either, so there's no reason they would be coming here

> the fact that we've never detected any means they've probably never detected us either

I do not think that your conclusion necessarily follows. They could easily be much more advanced than us, just as we are much more advanced than we were 500 years ago.

50 years ago we wouldn’t be able to detect today’s ourselves from Proxima Centauri. 500 years ago we would barely be able to do so from the Moon.

I am just saying that there could be a more advanced whatever you may call it that could detect us while we cannot. Much more advanced to us than we are today.

We peaked in our radio frequency output in the 60s. It might be smarter to limit your technosignatures once you reach a certain point of technology.

>> Representative Lauren Boebert (R-CO) asked panelists if they are familiar with "rumors that have come up to the Hill of a secretive project within the Department of Defense involving the manipulation of human genetics with what is described as non-human genetic material, potentially for the enhancement of human capabilities – hybrids." All four speakers said no

Stopped reading when I saw this person's name.

Hell if it keeps them from passing any laws for a couple years, have fun

I think the mixture of loyalty and psychopathy from government employees makes a weird mind landscape for people outside these institutions. The belief "the government has secrets and is keeping them from us" cannot be easily refuted. When I was in university, I had a professor that used to make jokes about how people who think the government is spying on everyone wore tin foil hats.

I am thoroughly annoyed by the title of the article: The government hears testimonies from government employees about government work! I'm saddened that this is considered newsworthy.

Now these “subscribe for full access” people can say they testified before Congress.

Room-temperature superconducting magnetic energy storage, powering a craft with a thruster like this: https://ivolimited.us/

I'm a researcher in this area if anyone wants to have a proper conversation. I'm 95% convinced that the major powers of the world have recovered crashed/landed non-human intelligence craft.

Before anyone responds to this comment, I would urge you to watch this video of Majority Leader Schumer and rising republican leader Mike Rounds giving a soliloquy on the senate floor to try to pass their UAP Disclosure Act and ask yourself - why would two senate leaders put their credibility on the line to try to pass a bill that references non-human intelligence 21 times?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z8a0P617nqw&t=93s

And, I would urge you to read the bill. It's one of the most comprehensive pieces of legislations that has been put out this decade https://www.congress.gov/118/crec/2024/07/11/170/115/CREC-20...

Non-human intelligence does not imply extraterrestrial intelligence.

In the context of that bill, it does.

> NON-HUMAN INTELLIGENCE.—The term ‘‘non-human intelligence’’ means any sen- tient intelligent non-human lifeform regard- less of nature or ultimate origin that may be presumed responsible for unidentified anom- alous phenomena or of which

That could be a test animal

Maybe if you would read the entire bill before commenting you'd realize that your comment is completely wrong.

I’m not going to bother, this is misdirection.

My guess is they found a room-temperature superconductor that can store incredible amounts of electrical energy, and the quantum drive from https://ivolimited.us/ actually works.

You really think the Senate Majority Leader would risk his reputation on a 60 page bill that references "non-human intelligence" 20+ times a misdirection? The only misdirection I see is your ignorance

No, it's your claim, onus is on you.

I pasted a link to the bill for everyone to read. You're expecting me to paste the entire 64 page bill in a hacker news comment?

You disagree with GP, and then to “back up” your disagreement you quote a passage that directly confirms GPs statement. What’s going on?

What part of the passage confirms GP's (who's GP?) statement? Again, I can't paste the entire 64 page bill in a hacker news comment. You have to do some effort to read the bill to figure out what they're talking about.

I recommend that you step away from "research".

Have you ever seen Congress debate laws around computing and the internet? Ever wondered how clueless they appear in that context?

They're lawmakers, that doesn't make them sudden experts in a wide range of fields. They are susceptible to outlandish conspiracy theories.

I'm not going to stop what I'm doing because some closed-minded person told me to.

These politicians are not experts, but the witnesses that have testified under oath are.

Lue Elizondo - GS15 officer at the DIA, who's last assignment was running Special Access Program for the National Security Council.

David Grusch - GS15 officer at NRO then NGA who handled the Presidential Daily Briefing for the NGA (meaning he was cleared to thousands of SAPs to consolidate information and brief the president)

[Karl Nell](https://www.linkedin.com/in/karl-nell-98203510/details/exper...) - too many positions to list, but one of the most notable was being a senior technical advisor to the Army's future command.

I don't disagree that congress gets lost in conspiracy theories, but almost never do people pandering those testify under oath in public, or privately to the intelligence committees or ICIG. You should open your mind and take a deeper look than the headlines.

You seem to assume that only you is interested in aliens.

Let me remind you that many of us grew up with The X Files.

Of course we paid attention. We just seem to be less gullible.

Why do you assume I'm gullible? just because I'm a bit more open-minded than you?

> Before anyone responds to this comment

Kind of a red flag already....

I'm certainly unconvinced by what "a few people say". I mean, "Extraordinary claims..." and all that — you'll have to do better than testimony.

What are you researching?

idk why you are getting downvoted. Schumer's full UAP Disclosure Act (unfortunately most of it was amended away) is groundbreaking legislation IMO.

It's one of the most comprehensive pieces of legislation in the last decade, and people just completely ignored it.

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