Trump to cancel student visas of pro-Palestinian protesters | Hacker News Reader

Trump to cancel student visas of pro-Palestinian protesters

reuters.com

29 pointsjohnneville14 comments

Is there an alternative hackernews interface that includes flagged but still popular stories?

hn.algolia.com

Does it have a "front page" view that could show flagged posts with > X upvotes? I think it'd be cool to allow that. Sometimes I get a little concerned that maybe there are networks of HN bots flagging political content. I don't think dang or HN are censoring HN, it's just that it'd be so easy to set up a bunch of accounts that flag stuff you don't want hackernews users to discuss.

https://news.ycombinator.com/active shows stories ranked by some popularity algorithm. It includes flagged stories. I use it in preference to the usual landing page.

1st Amendment topics means the courts will be deciding this one

The headline isn't really accurate, the article makes matters much clearer:

> A fact sheet on the order promises "immediate action" by the Justice Department to prosecute "terroristic threats, arson, vandalism and violence against American Jews" and marshal all federal resources to combat what it called "the explosion of antisemitism on our campuses and streets" since the Oct. 7, 2023, attack on Israel by Palestinian Islamist group Hamas.

They aren't just tagging random protesters, it's people who committed crimes during the protests. They would be losing their visas on that basis, not as a result of their speech or right of assembly.

Now it may still not happen, there will certainly be court battles, but I wouldn't assume that this is going to end well for the students.

Didn’t he pardon all of the J6 folks, even the ones who committed violent crimes?

He certainly did, note that I'm not arguing for Trump's consistency, moral probity, or respect for the law. What I am doing is clarifying that this is unlikely to become a 1st Amendment fight.

In a post truth, post law environment, my concern is “Show me the man and I’ll show you the crime” if an argument is “this only applies to lawbreakers.” How exposed you are is a function of your ability and resources to mount a defense against an administration that does not concern itself with the law.

Even if you haven't crimed, the opacity of what the administration will go after has a social cooling effect as people prefer to be silent over potential prosecution

https://www.socialcooling.com/

> What I am doing is clarifying that this is unlikely to become a 1st Amendment fight.

It is 100% going to become a First Amendment fight.

The EOs they have already used have similarly had a justifiable statement on the surface, but when put into action, they are much more egregious. Legal citizens are already being caught up in the deportation schemes.

This will be no different, it is fundamental to how they operate with plausible deniability and impunity

"A fact sheet on the order" is not the order itself or internal implementation instructions, it is public propaganda relating to the order. Inclusion of descriptions off the fact sheet in the article tell you how the administration is trying to sell the order, not substantive information about its effect or planned implementation.

EDIT:

Additionally,

> They aren't just tagging random protesters, it's people who committed crimes during the protests.

The order text goes well beyond crimes, and the order would be completely redundant if all that was at issue was crimes committed by visa holders. In fact, the only mention it makes of crime at all is creating an exception from its removal mandate where removal would inhibit prosecution of a crime.

> "To all the resident aliens who joined in the pro-jihadist protests, we put you on notice: come 2025, we will find you, and we will deport you," Trump said in the fact sheet. "I will also quickly cancel the student visas of all Hamas sympathizers on college campuses, which have been infested with radicalism like never before," the president said, echoing a 2024 campaign promise.

I see nothing about crimes here, except maybe thought-crimes.

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