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Comment by cstross | Hacker News Reader

"We don’t even tolerate people brining up concerns of racism here." Translation: "we don't want to admit that we have a toxic, racist corporate culture so we're going to blame the messenger."

The emphasis here is on racism, but there's a ton of casual sexism -- and I'd be surprised if ageism wasn't present, too.

This is, at best, a company where HR have taken their eye off the ball. More likely, there are serious institutional failings (and probable harrassment lawsuits coming down the pipe in 3 ... 2 ... 1 ... if they don't do something about the corporate culture fast).

Note: this is me trying to stay dispassionate and non-angry. If I was the author of this piece I'd be incandescent. Props to him for staying calm and documenting this stuff rather than simply walking out. Or exploding.

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> Note: this is me trying to stay dispassionate and non-angry. If I was the author of this piece I'd be incandescent. Props to him for staying calm and documenting this stuff rather than simply walking out. Or exploding

I couldn't even make it to the end, I think I just managed to read 80% of the whole piece, I'm pretty, pretty f.ing mad, and I've never even been to the States.

A little OT: And while we're on this, I guess this is a moment as good as any to get it off my chest, that is to say that nasty s.it like this happens not only in the States, but here in (Eastern) Europe, too.

I work in a small company, I'm IT, and around last week or so one of my (female, white) colleagues just out of the blue proffered somth. like "I'd kill all the gipsies, they're not human". I (white male, early 30s) at first tried to take it easy, made a little fun of her, to see if she was serious (she was), and then 10-15 minutes later I confronted her directly. The part that did it for me, at which even now, when I'm remembering the whole thing, makes me angry, it's the "they're not human" part. She is a really nice person otherwise, happily married, no children yet, but yet she said that nasty phrase as the most natural thing ever.

A friend once advised me, to seriously and intently ask such people "what the fuck is wrong with you?" (and possibly shake your head a bit in a confused mildly disgusted manner). Then walk away, because whatever they have to say is not going to be worth your time.

The one time I applied this, it netted me a rather sincere apology half an hour later, so I guess it has some merit in at least some of the situations.

(note that I was not in the group being discriminated against, I don't think it'd be a good approach if I were)

I doubt they have an HR department yet...

About 1/3 of the way down...

I ask if that’s the word he used verbatim, and Mike says yes. I say if he wants to say that to me I’ll take that comment and all the rest to HR because I’ve been documenting everything racist he’s said, and Mike nods and says “yeah” and “ok” like he understands or like he cares.

And the "HR Dept" could be just 1-2 people.

From the OP:

Also, at some point after this conversation took place, one of the women looked at my prized necklace and said “Hey, that looks like a calculator, is that a calculator?”

I said “um no, it’s a necklace, it’s African, from Nairobi.”

And she replies “Oh, huh…..well, it looks like a calculator.”

Dumbwhite------

If this is an accurate recollection, the author is a seriously disturbed person who should not be in this or any other workplace. If this is not an accurate recollection... I'm not sure the conclusion is any different.

Certainly there are workplace shootings where the perpetrator appears to have a very similar attitude - the Omar Thornton case, for instance:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hartford_Distributors_shooting

Kixeye is obviously a company with a corporate culture in which people vigorously insult each other in a typical young male style. A similar institution is the US military - at least at the enlisted level. Race relations in the military are and always have been excellent, so perhaps the hypothesis that coarse humor is the cause of racial hostility could use a little more exploring.

I wouldn't want to work at a company like Kixeye, though. It's obviously an even worse fit for the OP. And that's not even to mention that this kind of office culture is actually illegal in our great nation, land of the free and home of the brave. This is irresponsible toward the investors, at least...

> If this is an accurate recollection, the author is a seriously disturbed person

So you're saying that an overly defensive reaction to someone misunderstanding a fashion object means he's likely to shoot the place up? That a guy gets systematically discriminated against at the workplace, and you're worried he's too angry about it? And that he might get violent about it because one single other person one time did? And that the U.S. military, which features numerous official directives against racial discrimination, is an aptly analogous institution?

I like how this fixates on the smallest offense and considers it representative and most relevant for armchair psychological analysis.

Reverse the races and look at how you'd judge a black equivalent. This one "smallest offense" would color your perception of the person permanently.

Should I assume the white person is Italian, Irish, German, Russian, or what?

"Whiteness" is defined in contrast to a person's blackness. You can't talk about racism against whites without first acknowledging a previous racism by whites.

And that's not even to mention that this kind of office culture is actually illegal in our great nation, land of the free and home of the brave

Are you sarcastically implying that this kind of office culture should be legal in a civilized society?

This isn't "typical young male style"; it's typical douchebag style. If only they had the wit to at least be funny. Sometimes witty charm can go a long way. But these guys just seem like boring, unintelligent, run-of-the-mill idiots. Oh, and I wouldn't even dare call this "humor", coarse or not. You've now insulted the rich, long history of the term.

If I was the author of this piece I'd be incandescent

Reading this made me so angry... If I were a juror, I wouldn't convict the author for murdering the people in this post.

Edited to add: No actual murder has happened, nor should any actual murder happen. This was an overstatement meant to reflect outrage at injustice.

That's a pretty unacceptable viewpoint, especially as you have heard only one man's side of the story.

It's hyperbole meant to express my profound outrage at an apparently outrageous situation. To be clear, I do not endorse murder but when reading the article, I empathized with the author in a way that made me feel murderously angry.

Get a grip. Murderous rage isn't typically an acceptable response to things that upset you.

Murderous rage = being very angry. Not wanting to literally kill someone.

Metaphors are hard sometimes. I'm learning to be more cautious with them.

wtf?

I think this company is not such a great place to work... if you are black. Having mentioned that... uh... MURDER???

We should try to keep in mind that this company really may be no worse than the average SF company full of people accustomed to getting their own way. Oftentimes, people just don't know they are being offensive. It is not malice, so much as the obliviousness that accompanies any privilege. These people DO NOT deserve to die. I personally don't think anyone does.

People have a right to be disappointed here, but really, let's try to elevate the tone.

I totally agree that nobody deserves to die. I do not actually endorse murder, or any form of violent response to oppression.

As I stated earlier, I was being hyperbolic. I had a strong emotional response to the article and I made a joke about it. I did not mean to debase the quality of the conversation here and I regret the callous way I expressed what I said.

It's OK to make that kind of joke because nobody was murdered /sarcasm

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