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Comment by bko | Hacker News Reader

Maybe that's because software that we use every day (websites, saas, etc) generally get better over time and it's still relatively cheap. Meanwhile cars still rely on things like an archaic check engine light rather than just tell you what's wrong with the car and an infotainment system that's worse than a circa 2012 iPad.

People feel that cars haven't really improved much in practical terms over the last 20 years. At least to the layman, they don't feel smoother, safer, more comfortable to drive. They just got more expensive, more cameras and crap like auto-start that no one asked for.

So at least the hope is to take some of the best parts of modern software manufacturing and apply it to the car. Tesla did this and is why it was the first successful car company that's been started in the past 50 years or so.

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Cameras and auto start are both godsends and way better improvements than anything else including computerized features

Auto start is pretty much universally hated especially since it's ubiquitous and can usually only be turned off for a single ride. But cool, I'm glad you like it.

Cameras and electronics make the car much more expensive to repair.

But I'm confused, are you pro-technology in car or are you one of those that say "this exact level of technology is perfect, any more or less would be bad". I see this weird tech hater sentiment. For instance some are worried about technology taking blue collar jobs but if you suggest removing technology to create more jobs, they would be against that. Consider how many jobs the washing machine has taken. We could create millions of manual clothes washers if we got rid of them!

https://www.newsweek.com/automatic-start-stop-technology-new...

>>Auto start is pretty much universally hated especially since it's ubiquitous and can usually only be turned off for a single ride.

Which I absolutely don't understand. It's a fantastic technology and I wish I could retro-fit them to some of my older cars too, it's literally fantastic. Like, who likes sitting in standstill traffic and listening to their 4 cylinder rambler working when they are just standing still???? Even in my V8 LR3 I wish the engine would just shut off when in traffic, it's extra noise that's not needed or welcome inside the cabin. Especially since the advent of integrated starter generators, all the old arguments against it, how it's slow to start or how it wears out the starter motor have literally disappeared. But you still see people rabidly complain about it on forums, for no reason that I can see anywhere, other than "I just don't like it".

Great. Leave it on. I want it off, and I want it to stay off when turned off.

The start delay is not a big deal in traffic that's stop-and-go. But I have a poor-visibility situation at the end of my street, for which the only solution is "move away". There was a light indicating if a car was approaching over the hill, but when it was damaged the city didn't replace it. So when I hit the accelerator, I need the car to go right then. Not half a second or a full second later, when there might be a car that wasn't visible before coming at me.

>>I need the car to go right then.

And again, in modern cars with IGS systems the engagement is literally instantaneous. I really recommend trying it, it's pretty neat.

In a 2023 Mercedes it is most assuredly not instantaneous. Maybe it's just their implementation that's unpredictable. But that's the car my wife owns, so it's the one I've tried it on.

Still, keep using it if you like it. I don't hate that it exists. I hate that I can't turn it off and leave it off.

Yeah I'm just saying try it in a car where it works well. In my XC60 it's paired with an electric motor on the rear axle so even with the engine off the car accelerates from standstill like an EV - instantaneously and with plenty of torque.

> paired with an electric motor

Then you've changed the whole issue. I wouldn't have an issue with it in a hybrid at all, but in a pure ICE car, it's not always a good thing.

I suspect the hatred comes from the inability to leave it off. I don't have to turn my radio off every time I start the car. I don't have to turn off the climate control. I don't have to turn off the automatic wipers. If I turn them off, they stay off until I turn them back on.

The key word there is disappeared which means engineering effort was put into vehicle design to make it a non issue. more robust/new starter design, more expensive battery tech required, simulations to validate no carbon buildup and real world testing, software calibration to make sure if engine is too cold or turbo too hot doesn't auto stop. All driving up costs to consumer thus consumers would liek to have something for that added cost. For many rural drivers a typical commute may be 15 miles with 2-3 stoplights and 1-2 lights. this effectively negates the fuel benefitsand often is annoying when coming to a stop at a stopsign to have car turn off momentarily for no benefit and possibly detriment to fuel economy if the ratio of stop sign initiated auto stops is higher than stop and sit at a stop light. I do appreciate personally the moments of quiet when not moving but is it worth it the added cost to my vehicle ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

>>often is annoying when coming to a stop at a stopsign to have car turn off momentarily for no benefit

The benefit is that it's nice an quiet. I don't care about the fuel saving.

>>it worth it the added cost to my vehicle

I'm not sure what that cost is, even if there is one. My XC60 got rid of the starter motor and just uses then ISG which it would have to have anyway being a plug in hybrid. The engine obviously has to start and stop at any moment to allow EV running too, so that engineering had to be done anyway.

But I had one of the early S/S systems in a 2013 Nissan Qashqai and I never had any issues with it in my 7 years of ownership, not entirely sure if it added anything to the price of the vehicle as the previous model year with the same engine but no S/S cost exactly the same.

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