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Comment by paimapi | Hacker News Reader

So how would you change it now that you understand the legality?

I can't really follow. You say "I think the annoying part is that it is clearly illegal under most understandings of the Fourth Amendment," but at the same time say "I also think it's a pointless exercise to understand the legality of it."

I get the feeling the question being asked a bit leading, since you've been pretty hostile to me so far. I don't have a great answer, civil engagement and supporting politicians that also think it should be illegal for private companies to create gigantic mass surveillance dragnets?

The question is - how would you individually contribute to the movement of limiting mass surveillance? In the same way that we can all comment on a play made at a sports game, the actual effect of our commentary is nil except here the stakes are real and much higher.

I'm not being hostile and you're reading a lot of intent here for my frustration at apathetic armchair quarterbacking that I didn't direct at you.

I think I answered that question, note I didn't say "comment online" as a solution.

I guess I don't know who else it's directed at. I think it's important to understand the legality of our law enforcement's actions. I don't think that's an especially controversial take.

So your answer was "civil engagement and supporting politicians that also think it should be illegal"? Has that worked in the past on this issue? I asked that previously. What about in a post-Citizen's United world? How much an effect does your personal political speech have?

What's your answer?

I answered quite a few comments ago. Feel free to revisit.

What will a community group change?

https://www.comnetwork.org/blog/how-organizers-closed-down-a...

https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/dekalb-county/statue-john-l...

https://atlanta.capitalbnews.org/atlanta-communities-fight-d...

And these are just the movements I've personally been involved with. There's plenty of other examples rarely covered by mass media.

Aren't those all examples of civil engagement?

Not even a group, but just as an individual I was able to change a law enforcement practice. A local police force was posting misinformation about a new law that was going into effect and stated they planned to charge people with an M3 vs what the law says was a summary offense. I contacted the county DA and the local police pulled the misinformation and hopefully avoided incorrectly (maliciously) charging people.

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