The 'else' keyword is probably a literal translation from German (2020) | Hacker News Reader

The 'else' keyword is probably a literal translation from German (2020)

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Else is a given name in Denmark (a variation of Elsa, I'm guessing). At university we had a professor with the surname True; so if he had a daughter, her name could've been Else True. We found that quite funny.

Else If would also be a possible name in Denmark.

But, according to Statistics Denmark[1], none of those combinations exists:

Women with the first name 'Else' 13,047 Men and women with the last name 'True' 166 No one has the name 'Else True'

Women with the first name 'Else' 13,047 Men and women with the last name 'If' 6 No one has the name 'Else If'

[1] https://www.dst.dk/en/Statistik/emner/borgere/navne/hvor-man...

I don't know if the article writer is north American, or possibly not familiar with traditional/native English, else they would know they are completely wrong it not being English.

Also in the English speaking world, but getting rare: Elsie.

It's always "or else" when used as a conjunction in modern English.

"Take your coat or else you'll regret it."

"Hurry or else you'll miss the bus."

Etc.

> if something is true, then do a thing, else do a different thing.

> That's just English, right? Except that it isn't

No, it is English, grammatically correct English. It's not idiomatic English but it's a perfectly fine sentence otherwise.

Idiomatic English would simply require adding an or

    if(x)
        do m
    orelseif(y)
        do n
    orelse
        do o

But of course a native English programmer would quickly recognize the or is redundant even if it is idiomatic, and drop it.

> I think a carefully-chosen German word was probably translated as an archaic English word and then never revisited

This is a weird reach. Else isn't an archaic word.

"Eat your dinner or else."

"If you don't do it someone else will have to."

Plus all the "or else" conjunction examples.

It was probably chosen because it was shorter than "otherwise" and not for any other reason.

It is nor far-fetched to suppose else is a translated German word because that is exactly what happened. The only question is which German word was is it.

The only German that makes sense would be

wenn ... dann ... sonst

I don't know if the article writer is north American, or possibly not familiar with traditional/native English, else they would know they are completely wrong it not being English.

‘Else’ is not commonly used in English today but the meaning does fit. From Webster’s (1913):

Else, adverb or conjunction

1. Besides; except that mentioned; in addition; as, nowhere else; no one else.

2. Otherwise; in the other, or the contrary, case; if the facts were different.

“For thou desirest not sacrifice; else would I give it.” – Ps. li. 16.

After ‘or’, else is sometimes used expletively, as simply noting an alternative. “Will you give thanks, … or else shall I?” – Shak.

You can also say "elsewise", which to me still sounds a little old school, but more natural than just using "else" like we do in programming languages.

It's almost tempting to reach for "elsewhen" or "elsewhy", since we have "elsewhere". But if saying "elsewise" feels like chatting with a very elderly relative, saying those ones feels more like a seance with distant ancestors. But apparently it used to be a thing!

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/elsewho#English

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/elsewhither#English

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/elsewhence#English

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/elsehow#English

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/elsewards#English

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/elsewhat#English

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/otherwhat#English

Except for the phrase "or else!"

I came here to say this.

I my head as a child I instantly understood and thought "Ahhh, they mean like 'OR else this happens.'

I have always assumed it was a boolean logic thing meant to help show that it wasn't an AND, but 'or' had already been used as a keyword so they did 'or else' and dropped the reserved 'or'.

Else doesn't sound archaic to my ears.

"When you go shopping make sure to buy flour or else we won't be able to bake the cake"

"otherwise" is a more common word choice but "else" is definitely in the active vocabulary of modern English speakers.

"or else" is kind of redundant. One can omit one word or the other and it still works.

> When you go shopping make sure to buy flour, or we won't be able to bake the cake.

> When you go shopping make sure to buy flour, else we won't be able to bake the cake.

That’s “or else”. Bare else is no longer common.

> I can't use "else" as a conjunction in normal speech, only in computer programs.

sure you can. who's going to stop you?

someone else ;-)

Hurry up, else we'll be late. You'd better leave now, else you'll miss the bus. Do what I say, else there'll be trouble.

If the addressed person does not comply, you can also add "or else" in a threatening tone.

Such a funny movie.

Perhaps after the robot uprising... https://www.smbc-comics.com/comic/the-program

Else could I?..

Nice article.

Funny enough, even though I know if..then..else by heart for decades now, I also spent a few seconds on that 1960 arrow diagram of ALGOL60...

The modern universal keywords if, else, for and while are good because they are fairly short and thus quick to type.

Yes, otherwise is more natural but less terse.

"or else" works too but that's still three extra characters

We often write "otherwise" in mathematics:

https://arxiv.org/html/1501.05438v2#:~:text=otherwise,-%2C

https://arxiv.org/html/1302.5008v3#:~:text=otherwise

https://arxiv.org/html/1501.05438v2#:~:text=otherwise,-%2E

In fact, I think that's the most common alternative, not "else".

I'm writing some Crystal (which has Ruby-like syntax) and I'd add `unless` to the list. I like it!

"Unless" feels like adding come-from (next to goto) to a language. A statement/flow should not change its meaning after being declared/written IMHO.

edit: My criticism is for the suffix version to be clear. Unless / else is actually cool.

wdym? "unless" is literally "while not", no come-from mechanics

“unless” is “if not” — it is not generally looping construct.

`destroy_world() if $angry;` is Perl syntax. And Python has `destroy_word() if angry else live_long_and_prosper()`.

(But it's not remotely like come-from.)

P.S. in re the other response, "unless" is "if not". "until" is "while not".

`unless` came from Perl, Ruby adopted it, and so of course did Crystal.

”unless” already existed in early Lisps in the 1970s…

"loop" can all be typed with one finger, as the letters are all together on the qwerty keyboard, and the "o" repeats itself.

"while" on qwerty is sort of a chore.

Using more fingers allows for faster typing.

Usually for speed and avoiding strain you want to incorporate as many fingers as possible. In fact it's a common mark against dvorak online that "ls -l" is all typed with the right pinky (not an issue in the workman layout luckily).

Also remember this was typed with typewriters. That gives its own set of constraints. It's quicker to type two different characters than the same character twice in a row, as you need to wait for the typebar to return enough.

w TAB in a properly configured emacs

When you can touch-type, it's better to have keys spread to use separate fingers. That way, you divide up the work. You have one finger still lifting while the other's already starting the next press.

This guy better figure out how to use English, or else something bad will happen.

I think the headline is nonsense.

I was going to mention the MAD language by Bernard Galler et. al. that used whenever/otherwise, which I encountered in a book in the local library back in the days when everyone was coming up with "structured" programming languages, but then I scrolled to the bottom of the article ...

What about Kierkegaard?

He wrote Either/Or or Enten – Eller in Danish in 1843.

Else in Danish is Ellers.

I don't know if the article writer is north American, or possibly not familiar with traditional/native English, else they would know they are completely wrong it not being English.

it was probably a rote translation of the German word ‘sonst’

https://dict.leo.org/german-english/sonst

Das denke ich auch.

I found it strange (merkwürdig) that they didn’t mention this in the article.

Yes something like wenn…dann…sonst?

I remember I heard this structure at Uni at some point.

I remember it felt odd when XSLT code provided "otherwise" instead of "else".

Also, one thing that has been happening without much awareness in the history of computer languages: shorter identifiers win over long identifiers

Why not { } instead of begin and end?

def or fn over function/lambda (or just () => now)

Symbols are confusing at first but become practical after a bit

About TFA: Also 'if/or' would make people confuse logical or with bitwise or, so I guess that's why it was eschewed

Don’t even get me started on “elif”

I like elif. It means exactly what I want it to mean!

I also like iff and ffs.

That's a perfectly cromulent Turkish name.

If something were to be true, then foo.

Or if this other thing were to be true, then bar.

If it’s something else, then baz.

OR if is ambiguous, and wouldn't work like an 'else if' statement. I think you mean XOR.

No. English has used else to mean "otherwise" since before computers came along. Wiktionary offers this quote from Call of the Wild (1903):

"He had never seen dogs fight as these wolfish creatures fought, and his first experience taught him an unforgetable lesson. It is true, it was a vicarious experience, else he would not have lived to profit by it."

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/else#Conjunction

There's also "or else", as made famous in crime dramas: "Meet me by the docks at midnight. Bring the money. Come alone. No cops... or else!" But in other usage it can of course be followed by something. "He had to get to work on time, or else he might be fired."

"or else" is right in the second image, and it's clearly not "else".

Even if it hasn't been invented as the author claims, the question of who used it in code first is a valid one, right?

Some languages also have an "unless" keyword!

Perl also has "until" as the inverse of "while".

(It'll also let you use "unless ... else ..." - but please don't.)

But elsif

Article states else is archiac English but later says someone called it ignorantly incorrect English and suggested using "or".

Ive always assumed it was effectively "otherwise" but shortened to "or else" -> "else".

Given the alternative to use "or" as the first pushback I feel that acts as confirmation. I prefer else because "or" has implications in boolean and bitwise logic that else doesn't.

Give up this mad idea, or else.

If ... then ... otherwise ...

Fixed!

if ... then ... neht ... fi

what

> I can't use "else" as a conjunction in normal speech, only in computer programs.

Not true. Here's an example from 1876 in which "else" is used as a conjunction.

> My brother is poor, and I want to look as much like him as I can, else he may feel distant from me.

-- George Eliot ( https://www.victorianlondon.org/etexts/eliot/deronda-0047.sh... )

---

Here's an example of "if ... else" from the 1914 translation of Crime and Punishment ( https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Crime_and_Punishment/Part_IV/... ):

> Perhaps it will all come back, but now if you love me, give me up . . . else I shall begin to hate you, I feel it.

1611 Psalm 51:16 (KJV) uses else as a conjunction as well.

> > Perhaps it will all come back, but now if you love me, give me up . . . else I shall begin to hate you, I feel it.

It’s not being used in the programming if-else sense here. He’s not saying “if you don’t love me, I shall begin to hate you”. He’s saying “if you don’t give me up, I shall begin to hate you”.

if (you love me):

  give me up

else:

  I shall begin to hate you
  # i feel it

The English language origin is from programming if/then/else

Very not true.

What if time travel was involved?

  if time travel is involved
    an effect may come before its cause
  else if spooky action at a distance
    is allowed, in space or in time
    an event may cause an effect in the past
  else none of this is true or false

Else can be found in English text prior to computer existence. Else can't be found in a German dictionary as a conjunction [1]. The first suggestion in Duden is the name for alder tree in lower German. Second suggestion is a firstname. If a word would come from German, it seems the first step would be to look up in a German dictionary.

While the look up for history of computer language is interesting, the conclusion is completely wrong.

[1] https://www.duden.de/suchen/dudenonline/Else

I don't think the article author is concluding what you think they are.

The HN title reads "literal translation," which I didn't take to mean "literally".

The linked article doesn't really have a title. The article author states [...] "I think a carefully-chosen German word was probably translated as an archaic English word and then never revisited. Unfortunately we do not have the original German text to consult."

The claim is that it is a literal translation, not that it is a loan word from German. Ie the Germans wrote their paper for this new control flow in German wenn/dann/sonst, then took their Langenscheidt and looked up "sonst".

https://www.duden.de/rechtschreibung/sonst

https://de.langenscheidt.com/deutsch-englisch/sonst

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