Same goes for Linux. My CachyOS install on my Framework 13 Pro has a touch screen. There’s literally no downside for me having it. I don’t have to use it if I don’t want to. But if I want to scroll a website or scrub a video the option is there.
Same goes for Linux. My CachyOS install on my Framework 13 Pro has a touch screen. There’s literally no downside for me having it. I don’t have to use it if I don’t want to. But if I want to scroll a website or scrub a video the option is there.
We saw the same thing happen with mobile first on websites.
Or for that matter, that adding support for game controllers (something that has actually happened with Linux desktops) would led to curtailed development of non-controller parts.
Well, a lot of devs did move back to the terminal ;)
One of the most common actions among all computer users, zooming and centering a photo, is easier with a touch screen.
Even adding just that one thing is worth having a touch screen for.
Another example: working in the iOS simulator is now way easier because you can touch your apps that you're developing for iOS and iPadOS. And, by the way, macOS can run iOS/iPadOS apps directly from the App Store, so if there's something you really want to run that you just can't find a macOS equivalent for, there you go, you can just do it and interact with the app more naturally.
The value of “tablet mode” would mainly be if I want to do content consumption, like watch video or read a book, while on the couch or in bed since it allows a wider range of postures you can sit or lay in when you don’t have to rest it on a flat surface.
If you can’t fold it back I just don’t get the appeal.
The sweet spot for me is the iPad mini, but I tend to use tablets as glorified e-readers and video players; the only serious work I do on them is reading.
With that said, I have zero problem with touchscreens or convertable form factors. In fact, I used a Surface Pro for years as my main laptop, and it was one of the best Windows laptops I've used.
But again, I'm not a big fan of mobile devices as primary computing devices unless I'm actually working on the go.
Even for commuting back and forth between an office and a home office, I'd rather just put something along the lines of a Mac Studio in a bag — for a few months last year, it was actually a SFF (not micro, weighed about 10 kg) Dell OptiPlex in an aluminium briefcase, which was fine!
Windows 8, which was tablet-oriented, was one of these skip generations of windows that nobody cares about in the end, and when the next comes everybody forgets. I never installed it anyway. I have not owned a touchscreen laptop myself since then, but from friends that have and I have used theirs, it is like OP described as a "harmless additional feature/why not", something that just makes certain interactions a bit faster.
But especially on an actual laptop, one that you cannot just separate the screen from the keyboard, stuff like "virtual keyboard" and "tablet mode" matter much less because it is not like you will take it and use it as a pure tablet anyway.
So actually, you are harmed by this decision every day you use a Windows 10/11 laptop. You live with this every day. You just don't know what you're missing.
Would it change anyhthing? No. Because developers of the programs what are not part of Windows aren't keen on keeping "the same efficiency". Audacity 4, Thunderbird are good examples of a bad interface - and they did it disregarding the OS UI.
They are basically throwing away the existing UI asking with its decades of refinement in favor of something that looks like what you'd get if apple mail and outlook had a disfugured child.
That's because you are just accustomed to it [0]. If you would have a fresh look on it, especially on a small screen - it would find it atrocious.
There is still a separate SMTP configuration and it's a separate separate SMTP configuration for the each account.
There is absolutely useless left vertical bar which... does nothing what can't be shoved unto the useless, empty top bar. There is useless empty top bar which holds a search box and a hamburger menu.
For the unknown reason[1] this top bar is twice the tall of the regular menu. Oh. There is TWO search boxes[2]. Enabling Quick Filter adds another toolbar instead of using the bar where the button 'Quick Filter' resides.
And if you have multiple accounts and for some reason you can't auth for a moment (eg server problem, not with a connection) you would be spammed with the auth boxes and even if you successfully auth in one - you would still need to cancel or auth in all other what was spammed on you.
There is a lot, a lot of things where TB sucks. You just familiar with it.
[0] and probably configured it years ago and never touched the config too.
[1] actually it to be tall enough to hold hamburger button - because there is an option to add buttons to it. But you can't move buttons from the left useless vertical bar to the top bar. So you can have 'Mail', 'Calendar' etc duplicated on the top bar... for what?
NB yes you can hide the left vertical bar. Hide, not remove. Still it was thought on, implemented and shoved on our asses for absolutely no reason..
But even if I accept your premise, I’ll remind you that Windows 7 came out 19 years ago. I didn’t exactly own a 27” 4K monitor in 2009, and a 14” or 16” screen laptop in 2009 would not have been thin and light like it is today. 2009 was like “my bezels are over a half inch wide” era.
The OS is fully scalable as well. You can just make it smaller in a very granular way. Windows 7 wasn’t capable of that.
This isn’t an unimplemented theory. You can head over to Best Buy right now and see what it’s like to use a touch screen laptop.
I feel like all this debate is taking place in an odd vacuum where a lot of us are talking about a bunch of potential problems with having a touch screen on a computer and all these problems are already resolved.
Maybe it’s similar to the whole iPhone duo thing where Apple users are just discovering all the caveats of a foldable phone, but we’ve already gone over all of it with competitors.
I rarely used tablet mode but genuinely miss having a touchscreen.
what i've learning developing and creating products over the years is that harmless features tend to be the ones that cause the most problems. for ex, now you have to add touchscreen code to the OS vs previously not having it at all. and this code or feature we will support for the rest of the lifetime of that product.
In the case of touch screens, it hasn't caused a lasting problem in Windows or Linux.
However, I still feel like Apple is in their Microsoft era where they're making some of the same mistakes Microsoft have made in the past 20 years.
Aero -> Liquid Glass
Ads in the OS -> Ads in core applications
Fullscreen ads for Microsoft services in the OS -> banner ads for Apple services in the OS
Dark patterns for Windows 11 upgrades -> Dark patterns for macOS 26 upgrades
Windows Mixed Reality -> Vision Pro
I could also say Surface Duo -> iPhone Duo but at this time it's too early to tell. I also think that a touchscreen Mac is a mistake. Not because it's something Microsoft already did but because the reason a MacBook does not need a touchscreen is because Apple has best-in-class trackpads.
1. Takes extra battery 2. I’m not touching my screen regardless. It gets dirty enough
My last three or four laptops, which never even booted Windows, have had disabled touchscreens
Apps in Windows and KDE don't really change their behavior just from having a touch screen.
I routinely forget that my Framework 13 Pro even has a touch screen.
Every watt matters, and turning it off hurts nothing I care about.
And apps DO change their behavior. The on screen keyboard pops up when the screen on a KVM connects before the keyboard.
Why the hostility? I’m not going to touch my screen anyway to try to avoid making it filthy.
I'll list out two immediate benefits with zero UI changes that macOS touch screen users will get:
iOS developers will be able to touch their apps in the simulator.
Pinch/zoom/centering photos will be highly intuitive for basically everyone because basically everyone has family photos and a photo library.
Go over to the Lenovo/Dell/HP website and you'll see that they offer a touch screen option for something like $50 and you can just choose whether you have it or not.
Go buy a $450 iPad from Apple and it has a touch screen. That's cheaper than any Mac on sale.
Hey, that's another great point, maybe Apple's laptops could be more customizable and modular, wouldn't that be nice?