Tesla Opens Cybercab Orders to 'Select Customers' at $29,990 Plus $299 per Month | Hacker News Reader

Tesla Opens Cybercab Orders to 'Select Customers' at $29,990 Plus $299 per Month

insideevs.com

28 pointsiBelieve46 comments

Sure, it's geofenced right now. Sure, the subscription is triple what supervised FSD is right now. Sure, Elon's been overhyping and overpromising for a long time (though I appreciate that he's willing to dream big!). And will Tesla actually deliver this on time and as promised? We'll see. But I think it's super cool to see a company offering fully autonomous self-driving cars to private individuals. I think that's a pretty big milestone. I really look forward to someday being able to privately own a vehicle where it can drive me places unsupervised while I sleep or work or relax.

> But I think it's super cool to see a company offering fully autonomous self-driving cars to private individuals

Wait, hasn't Tesla always claimed to sell fully autonomous self-driving cars to private individuals? How is this new?

Sure, that's been the goal, but now they're actually close to delivering on that promise. A privately owned vehicle with unsupervised self driving seems like a major milestone after supervised self driving like current Tesla FSD or company-owned unsupervised driving like Waymo or Robotaxi and the like.

Close by what definition ?

Waymo and others are hardly FSD, they have hoardes of Phillipinos ready to take over as reported by papers like the NYT.

> they have hoardes of Phillipinos

What are Phillipinos?

I suppose a misspelling of Filipino?

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

The terms of use:

• You can only use the Cybercab for personal use (for now). You can't use it for commercial use.

• You can't modify Cybercab, including adding wraps, window tint, or changing wheels, except through Tesla or an authorized provider.

• Three or more safety strikeouts result in one-week suspension, during which Cybercab may be unable to operate.

• Cybercab has touchscreen-based manual controls that allow movement at speeds up to 2 mph, intended for short-distance maneuvering rather than public-road driving.

• Cybercab can autonomously drive itself, without passengers, to a Tesla Service Center for maintenance and return home afterward.

• Owners remain responsible for insurance, registration, parking, charging, general cleaning, and other expenses.

This is an absolute game changer for disabled people who can’t drive and don’t live with access to public transportation or ride sharing.

The legal side still needs to be worked out, but I can imagine this giving a lot of people their independence back.

On the flip side I wonder what the legal ramifications are for being intoxicated in the backseat when this thing runs a red.

I could imagine an aggressive DA still charging people.

Not while it costs $3600 / year to basically rent time in your own car for which you're already making a car payment. unless you mean for the disabled wealthy.

> This is an absolute game changer for disabled people who can’t drive and don’t live with access to public transportation or ride sharing.

and also live and travel exclusively within the geofence region, and who would otherwise spend more than $299/month on taxis/Uber/etc., and whose disability is compatible with the vehicle, and who are on the Tesla shortlist of "select customers".

I'd love to be optimistic about this. I was an early optimist. Like, in 2009 I was expecting something like the Cybercab is except without a geofence by 2019, that level of optimism.

But… "select customers"? And that geofence? Nah. For all that we finally have something that doesn't have a steering wheel, those are extremely suspicious caveats.

You have to start somewhere.

Within 5 years the legal stuff will be sorted. Competition will arise. The price is high, but you might share it with the rest of your household.

> You have to start somewhere.

I know, but I've gone from being impressed with Tesla to disappointed because of their history of over-promising and under-delivering.*

> Within 5 years the legal stuff will be sorted.

Legal stuff?

Whatever you're looking for in law that isn't ready yet, doesn't mean the geofence will be as large as a whole city, let alone a state or a nation, like Musk was forecasting nearly 11 years ago for 2018: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_predictions_for_autono...

> Competition will arise. The price is high, but you might share it with the rest of your household.

You can share a normal car with the rest of your household, too. 30k upfront and 299/month is expensive compared to car leases, like "luxury/premium" expensive. And my dad spent a lot of time banned from driving due to epilepsy, so my previous long list of extra caveats gets to add something from my experience: and also no friends or family members who will take you places.

And sure, I do also expect competition, just when the tech's finally ready. The caveats on this announcement are just so many, and the prior behaviour of Musk overstates reality by so much, that I am not expecting anyone's tech to be a "gamechanger" any time soon.

* Though looking at Musk's history of infamy, it only seemed to transition from "fake it 'till you make it, but you do make it" to "uh oh" around 2016.

Can people roll their roadster deposits over to it?

Do you need a license to drive it?

You do not need a license to ride in a cybercab now, and have no ability to “drive” it anyway. It has no controls.

I can only assume you do not need a license.

But do you have to be over... What? 16? 18? To ride alone?

Yes. Over 18 to ride alone.

13-17 with an adult.

Under 13 not allowed.

Obviously the service is changing rapidly, and we don’t know of the “ownership” version will be different from the Tesla taxi version.

Utterly game changing for disabled people. I remember how much my blind uncle’s life changed with Uber.

It can be driven:

"Cybercab has touchscreen-based manual controls that allow movement at speeds up to 2 mph, intended for short-distance maneuvering rather than public-road driving."

Only by Tesla staff.

Regular people can not access that screen.

Such a situation with an upcoming hyper-centralization that is now possible-plausible - even worse than current oligopolies-monopolies - will require the general population to actually rally to make sure there are controls in place to manage and keep pricing in check.

So it’s a car. That you can’t drive yourself. That you have to pay a subscription fee just for the privilege to be able to use it. Even though you purchased the hardware (the car). It doesn’t work if you don’t give Tesla a continuing revenue stream and is geofenced to select areas and isn’t useful outside of those areas?

To top it all off, you have to be “invited” to purchase it. You know what at this point I’d happily watch this fail.

There isn’t anything that I find appealing about this value proposition because unless you’re a true believer and are willing to lose money on this, this shouldn’t appeal to consumers. I’d have happily watched this never been released at all and to be honest given Elon’s track record it might not.

It’s very clear the geofence will get bigger and bigger until it’s everywhere. That could be a year from today, it could be ten. Very likely it’s in that range. They just made the cybercabs operate 24x7 in cities that have them.

Obviously not everyone wants this, but of course not everyone wants a bugatti veyron or a minivan either. We each get to choose how we spend our money on goods and services that meet our needs, we perceive as good value and bring happiness.

I’ll never own a track car. I’ll never own a cybercab. But I wouldn’t want to stop other people from doing so if they choose.

I think of it as having your own personal driver.

Where are you going to get that for less than $30,000 / year in the Bay Area?

Now consider you're giving your personal driver (available 24/7) a hiring bonus of $30k and then only pay them $3600/year.

It's even better than that. Presumably you will be able to recoup some of that $30k if you decide to sell it.

Grouchy people like you were saying the same thing about FSD. It'll never work, it'll never work outside of straight highways, it'll never work in traffic, it'll never work on city streets, it'll get shut down by the govt, it'll never work in construction, it'll never work in parking lots. Not sure where the goal posts are now, but you guys can continue being grouchy while you manually drive your dinosaur juice cars around.

Yeah!! And FSD will work, any day now!

For that matter: how does "self-driving only" even work for a personal car, from a practical perspective - e.g. how do you get it to park in a particular spot? Can you take it through a drive-thru, or a toll booth? How about a car wash? Will it respond appropriately to a police car trying to pull it over or guide it around an accident? Etc, etc.

All of these are problems which can be ignored or worked around for a taxi, or for a car with an optional self-driving mode - but if there's really no way to control the car manually, the car needs to be able to handle everything itself. And I'm not sure it can.

Today it is already driving paying people around real cities 24x7 handling many of those things you listed.

Train crossings are still a no go, but clearly it continues to get better, geofences are increasing in size and it’s expanding to new cities.

The expansion to 24x7 was just yesterday or the day before.

This is like a preview/demo/introductory offer to test the waters. It does not have to have an appealing value proposition. Will go out to some "true believers" and they will try it out etc.

As geofence gets larger, more issues like automated cleaning/charging get solved, tesla/customers/insurance companies figure out insurance situation, laws get friendlier for privately owned cars without steering wheels etc, the robotaxi fleet management software gets features, these same cars will be able to join robotaxi fleet when you are not using them.

That's why it is invite only (for now).

That just means that you’re not in the target market. Other people might be though. Consider this: how much would you pay to have a chauffeur, and how does that compare with actually hiring one?

For those who can afford one, you're looking at the first mass market kids' chauffeur.

Let's say you bought one for personal use.

I think this car doesn't have an inverter to charge from AC, so it requires a supercharger.

I wonder if there will be a home dc fast charger?

Or it just takes itself to a supercharger and back in the middle of the night when you don’t need it.

Tesla are paying people to plug them in and unplug them at select superchargers.

Over 18 to ride alone.

13-17 with an adult.

Under 13 not allowed

So I pay $299 a month for a car that has no steering wheel, and that doesn't include insurance? Am I allowed to "drive" it while intoxicated? Trying to understand the value proposition. Maybe for my mother inlaw who shouldn't be driving?

> Am I allowed to "drive" it while intoxicated?

Yes, just like you can currently use Tesla's robotaxi service while intoxicated

It has manual controls, and therefore will likely be treated the same as a regular ca, I.e. need a license, can't be intoxicated.

"Cybercab has touchscreen-based manual controls that allow movement at speeds up to 2 mph, intended for short-distance maneuvering rather than public-road driving."

How much will it cost in AI credits to jailbreak it and plug in an Xbox controller to drive it?

Isnt this just a way of saying, "Yes its not really self driving, but you can rent it and let someone ELSE die!"

Anyone who buys this is going to shoulder so much liability I would be surprised any ins company would cover it.

Classic Tesla.

lmao it needs a subscription to operate, and there’s no steering wheel? so you’re essentially buying a brick and paying a subscription to hope they let you continue using it.

"Select Customers", aka Tesla influencers.

Robotaxi was supposed to cover 50% of US population by the end of 2025, how is that going ?

30k + 300/month makes absolutely no sense given that they are restricted to smallish areas of operation. Just another Tesla PR stunt.

It's really not bad when you think about it. Basically a private chauffeur around town for $30K + 300 bucks a month. If it had a steering wheel to go outside of the autonomous zone I would buy one. If I was richer I would buy one without a steering wheel as a second car so I don't have to drive for 90% of my trips.

Whats to stop Elon getting greedy and changing the price ?

Based on my experience with Starlink: nothing

Just as a reminder, Musk's hacking apart of USAID led directly to the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people in the third world. He's also a white supremacist actively funding and promoting the global far-right. But yes, new product release, what fun, whee.

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