Deaf, Blind Sue Over Web Shopping
online.wsj.com
online.wsj.com
Amazon and other giant retailers could still survive, even if they where made to comply with all of these requests (although it would slow innovation considerably). Small online stores couldn't afford it and would simply shut down. This is bad for everyone.
This reminds me of what happened in Julian, CA - a small mountain town. An overzealous lawyer decided to start suing everyone with steps into their tiny bookstores and coffee shops as a means to extort money out of them. Several just shut down.
http://www.utsandiego.com/uniontrib/20060729/news_1n29pinnoc...
The "innovation" has been on the shipping/distribution side.
I do still see the possibility of predatory litigation. To protect small businesses, maybe the burden should shift to the web developers that they hire. Much like we expect contractors to know the ins-and-outs of building codes, we should come to expect web development agencies to understand their clients' legal obligations.
> A large part of compliance is just utilizing the
> accessibility tools built into HTML: semantic markup,
> proper use of alt and title tags, etc.
This "just" is actually quite a large and expensive: Developers and their management need additional tools and training, and extra hours must be spent every release cycle ensuring that compliance is maintained.Imagine a small business owner asking their web developers if they used alt or title attributes properly? Absurd, right? I can't name a single plumbing instrument other than a plunger, and I don't have to because there is a division of labor. If my toilet gets backed up and it's not as simple as making sure the ball in the tank didn't get jammed, I call a plumber.
Edit: I fail to see how this is any different than making sure your webpages are not vulnerable to SQL Injection, XSS, CSRF...etc. Surely you protect your websites against those, and write code accordingly, right?
I personally ignore most on-page SEO trick things, and just focus on accessibility when I can. If a screen reader can handle it, Google can handle it and understand it. I'd rather focus on people than machines. If companies can take time to SEO-trick out their page, they can focus on accessibility.
Now the associations are suing companies for not being accessible. This is ridiculous. How much of that money will go to benefit of people in need and how much will go to such people?
http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2012/sep/18/prolific-disabled...
Agreed on good laws problem, good laws applied poorly are bad laws.
- Any valid HTML site has an `alt` attribute in all of its image tags. This helps screenreaders read the image, and could probably satisfy the "spoken captions of images" requirement.
- Sites that cleanly separate layout from presentation are already quite easy for screenreaders to parse. Go ahead and run `links -dump http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Blindness` for example; it just has a bit of boilerplate and then the content begins. There's even "Jump to: [navigation], [search]" links that are hidden with CSS for those who don't use it.
I think this will primarily affect sites that rely heavily on javascript to try and create the sense of a large application. This is another good argument to separate the presentation and logic from the content of the site.
The Equality Act in the UK has much tougher provisions, and has for a long time under the Disability Discrimination Act before it. British business has not collapsed under the weight of supporting it yet.
If you're really struggling to make your website compliant then you can go on the government website and it even tells you the appropriate guidelines. In addition, the W3C publish their own sets of guidelines for you to follow.
For Add-Ons, you have Fangs to show you how a screen reader sees your page. There are simple tools that will tell you if there is sufficient colour contrast between your text and background.
Using terminal (text only) browser such as Links is great way to test accessibility.
Sounds intresting, but the link is broken...
A much better approach IMHO is to encourage companies to create or open their APIs, and to encourage those who need better accessibility or their advocates to create alternate interfaces to their services. Think of it like a "marketplace of user interfaces".
Perhaps instead of passing a law to force existing UI's to change, the government should work with private industry to encourage open APIs.
However, in my interactions with people with visual disabilities, I've come to understand that for many of them, the ability to use the same technology as everyone else is actually quite important. Everybody else uses Windows, why shouldn't they be able to? Everybody else shops on the Amazon website, why not them? To say they should use a separate interface is tantamount to telling them to go to the special grocery store for the blind people.
I don't really know that this is a constructive way of thinking, but it's important to consider.
> However, in my interactions with people with visual
> disabilities, I've come to understand that for many
> of them, the ability to use the same technology as
> everyone else is actually quite important.
Well of course. Computers are one (if not the) most important tools of our era, and everyone who wants to participate in our technological society needs to use computers in one form or another. But we shouldn't conflate putting computers to work for us with the user interfaces we use to control them.The good news is that as more and more web applications introduce APIs, they're making it easier to change the interface but still use the tool. Companies could be encouraged to focus more their time and energy on supporting those in the community who want to build alternative interfaces for their applications, instead of using that time and energy to defend themselves from lawsuits.
| "marketplace of user interfaces"
Most of which would be used for phishing. > Most [alternative users interfaces] would be used
> for phishing.
That's a legitimate concern, but one that I'm sure could be overcome with a little thinking and work. After all, how do companies prevent phishing now?My father was blind for 30 years until he died but never tried to impose on society in any way in that period - I can't imagine him ever agreeing in the slightest with the proponents of these ideas.
"No" is not acceptable, at least not to me. I have no disabilites, but I think that there should be accommodation for disabilities in society. Perhaps below a certain business income or traffic the requirements are reduced or go away, and that's where we're not very good at balance.
As commerce, government and social interaction move online, it becomes imperative (yes) that we make accommodations for disabilities. The more we are, the better we are, so it's good for "the rest of us" as much as for "them."
In the end, it's likely an "eat your spinach" issue as said in the article: you bring more people and benefit in by your accommodation than the accommodations cost. Where that falls down is the micro-operations, and that's where I think we need some balance. Big ops can afford all this and more, but you won't get more big ops unless you let the small ops grow through that stage.
Of course, ADA takes a little additional time and care (not much, but hey, if you're agile and running lean, your MVP can't let regulations get in the way, right?) The government wants to regulate my site, but they just don't get it. ADA is the result of a dying industry that don't apply to me because I'm disrupting. DISRUPTING!
"Mr. Smith also advises companies to ensure that people with motor disabilities can navigate websites without the use of a mouse"
As if I needed more reasons to not host my sites in the US.
What he means is that you must actually use HTML's alt and title attributes properly so that screen-readers can produce these spoken descriptions.
That strikes me as a fairly reasonable burden.
[1] http://googlewebmastercentral.blogspot.com/2007/12/using-alt...
Sometimes, it is just not possible to develop for a small subset of users for financial or technical reasons.
I don't think we can take the attitude that it's an undue burden. Small businesses don't always get to say they're too small for a wheelchair ramp (I know this varies by location, but you get the point). If you can't afford to meet a certain subset, maybe you need a new career. In time, dismissing a group of users because it's not financially attractive may be deemed illegal for developers, as it has been for brick-and-mortar for a long time.
Correctly adding meta and title etc for screen readers, I'm in for that. In fact, I make sure to add proper alt tags for images already. Will improve of other things for sure m
What the article means by that is text that can be turned into spoken descriptions by speech synthesis.
There is no "voice stuff". A lot of enabling accessibility is fixing your non-compliance with HTML standards - always have alt tags on your images and the such.
We're not talking about supporting a completely new frontend strictly for blind users, the facilities for accessibility are already in our base web technology, the only demand here is to use them correctly.
Compliance isn't free, but to make the argument than this is like overhauling an old building is entirely false.
> That could mean websites will be required to include spoken descriptions of photos and text boxes for the blind, as well as captions and transcriptions of multimedia features for the deaf, said Jared Smith, associate director of WebAIM, a nonprofit group that trains and evaluates companies on Web accessibility.
This is what I was talking about. I support correct HTML tags and standards anyway. But all the things mentioned above are an overkill.And it's not about small guys only. Imagine YouTube being sued for not having captions over all videos? Why due anyone for this, ask them nicely!
Visually handicapped people already use screen readers that will read website aloud to them. The demand here is to ensure websites are compliant enough with basic HTML spec that said screen readers work.
The screen readers I've seen don't do anything crazy - they are even fairly tolerant of bad markup, but they aren't magic. The demand here is for websites to care enough to format properly so screen readers actually work.
Accessibility helps all users.
I memorise all the keyboard shortcuts and keyboard navigate as much as I possibly can. My biggest peeve with webapps is that they usually slow me down to hunt-and-peck speed.
Lacking a real way to trigger UI elements programmatically testing frameworks have almost universally fallen back on hijacking the accessibility features of the OS to do its work.
This makes me very concerned for actual app accessibility, since not only are we failing to implement accessible features (Apple's defaults are quite good, though imperfect) but we're actively breaking it instead.
The problem is that we're corrupting the data being fed into the framework to further our testing ends. Things like accessibilityLabel and accessibilityValue which are supposed to power screen readers are now instead filled with semantic data to facilitate testing.
UI elements that aren't (and shouldn't) be screen readable now have accessibilityLabels attached to permit testing. UI elements that should have accessibilityLabels have their default values overridden so some test can have visibility into internal state, etc.
You can avoid this - by #ifdef'ing your codebase straight to hell to make sure these don't make it into the shipping app, but I also don't see this being done.
On the plus side it seems like TDD in general isn't a thing in the iOS development scene, though it's picking up, so most apps haven't messed with accessibility yet.
Sounds like the testing frameworks have an obligation to provide a tool that can "clean" code for the final working version. Is there a way to do this in XCode without #ifdef'ing? (such as a pre-compilation plugin?)
Say you have a button that says "Send Email" - the default accessibility label would have the screen reader just read the text, and that's great. And your testing framework can layer on top of this and, say, make sure the button works.
It gets a bit more complicated when you apply more rigor to testing - you need the ability to query the state of your program in a way that isn't truly necessary for usability, and forces developers to implement things in ways that are far from intuitive.
Take an example, let's say you're building a Facebook app. Instead of "Like This Post", you might have to label the button "Like joebob's post at 3/23/2012 2:17PM" just so the testing framework can uniquely identify one button over another. And this brokenness is hidden, since the visible button is still labeled "Like This Post".
Worse, say you want to test that a view changes size when interacted with. Now you're literally embedding sizes and coordinates into accessibility hints/values/labels to make this happen. This devolves very, very quickly.
There's been some promising progress on iOS automated testing - the fact that it's happening represents a maturing of the platform and an embrace of quality engineering rather than the seat-of-pants approach we've seen thus far. That being said, the most popular frameworks are still woefully immature.
"The U.S. Department of Justice is expected to issue new regulations on website accessibility later this year that could take a broad view of the ADA's jurisdiction over websites. A Justice Department spokeswoman declined to comment.
"That could mean websites will be required to include spoken descriptions of photos and text boxes for the blind, as well as captions and transcriptions of multimedia features for the deaf, said Jared Smith, associate director of WebAIM, a nonprofit group that trains and evaluates companies on Web accessibility.
"Mr. Smith also advises companies to ensure that people with motor disabilities can navigate websites without the use of a mouse, and to use plain language and a strong design to aid people with cognitive or intellectual disabilities."
And if this stifles "innovation" in web site design, well that would be fucking fantastic. We really don't need more "innovation" by web site designers--they've already done enough damage to the internet.
The disabled being denied access to critical infrastructure is a market failure†. That’s why there is a discussion about regulation.
It would be super great if everything could be solved by the market (politicians tend to be clumsy, not the brightest and not super efficient), sadly I cannot see that being possible. A world in which the market solves everything neatly along our moral views would be pretty awesome, I just don’t think that’s the world we live in.
I want market solutions to as many problems as possible and will happily accept them whenever they exist. If they don’t, however, I’m more than happy to begrudgingly accept a regulatory approach.
—
† Underlying this is the assumption that the disabled should not be violated in their human dignity. If you do not share this view then you might arrive at different conclusions and I don’t think I want to talk to you any further.
This is why the government does these things: To break Nash equilibria that have harmful externalities. In this case, the harmful externality is handicapped people having shittier lives. Much the same logic applies to what the EPA does.
> .... and to use plain language and a strong design to aid people with cognitive or intellectual disabilities....
How is this measured? This is the most disconcerting part of the article to me.
Taking it to an extreme, is Amazon liable when someone with cognitive impairments accidentally buys $10,000 of stuff with one-click shopping for failure to understand the concept?
Is ebay liable for inadequately explaining the concept of a bid at the level of someone with a 70 IQ?
It would be a value add service to have a disabled person test their use of my site for various tasks and give me honest feedback.