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Comment by kamakazizuru | Hacker News Reader

right, this is pretty much the attitude with which colonial powers approached new continents. The universe was not built for humans alone - if there is life there - which in its current form is unable to protect itself - it is our duty to protect it and leave it untouched - not kill it in hordes and put the remaining few in reserves and allow them to open casinos as a consolation prize.

EDIT: On the other hand - if it is life that can protect itself - i.e. - attack human explorers or cause unintentional harm to them - then we also need to be able to understand that in an isolated environment before we just touchdown and put up our IKEA stuff..

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We're not talking indigenous tribes here; its maybe some (unsuccessful) bacteria. You willfully destroy these every time you use mouthwash.

Lets not get all PC about some stains on some dirt on a rock somewhere.

You're implying that the inside of your mouth and the landscape of Mars are more or less equivalent?

Bone dry and dangerous to breathe describes my mouth some mornings.

I dont see your point apart from trying to sound as nasty as possible? Just because they arent tribes means they're irrelevant? They are indigenous species and should be protected in the interest of science if nothing else. You dont eliminate every bacteria of a certain species when you use mouthwash. In the grand scheme of things we are also just some stains on some dirt on a rock somewhere.

You're projecting. I just don't value a few struggling bacteria the same way you do.

In the interest of science, you can keep some on your desk in a petri dish. As for the rest of mankind, we'll be using all the resources in our solar system that are available. The future belongs to a system-spanning culture that will terraform, relocate and resurface every available rock we find to make more space for life.

While your techno-optimism is very inspiring, I'd rather not be the victim of a solar system black plague either. On the other hand, since we're speculating, I'm looking forward to the one piece of "dirt on a rock" somewhere that can make me immune to radiation while on my space voyage.

You're assuming that they'd a few struggling bacteria - and that all of mankind wants to quit earth and spread as far and wide as possible. Both of which is basically bullshit. If anything - our population is heading towards its peak - which will follow with a sinking population. A majority of the developed world is greying - these are people who would have access to plenty of space and resources for their offspring - choosing not to have more. So I guess since you've taken on the role of the spokesperson for the "rest of mankind" - you might want to check in and see if humans are really that eager to go live on every rock in the solar system - or are fine where they are.

I don't have to run a poll. There's me, and folks like me. That's enough. Colonization never means 'most folks'; it always means only those willing to take risks and try something new. So your greying, senescent population can go ahead and stay at home without affecting anything regarding mankind's future.

I strongly suspect that if you took a poll, you would find that the real shortage will be a shortage of seats on rockets, not people to fill them. Even if people with a suitable exploratory attitude are one in a million, that still gives you thousands of volunteers.

Not if they have to pay it themselves

Yes, even if they have to pay for it themselves. Someone interested in being an off-world colonist will have little use for earth assets; they could liquidate everything. Even if you peg it at tens of millions, you would still have more willing volunteers than rocket seats for the foreseeable future.

Though I am not sure why you assume that would necessarily be the scenario..

It seems as though you think he's alone in voicing the least bit of concern for the fact that it might be valuable to hold up a second before steamrolling the (hypothetical) only extraterrestrial life we've discovered in the universe in the pursuit of a future which to me sounds, quite frankly, disgusting. Claiming that mankind shares your views en masse and furthermore making declarative statements about who "owns" the future is a monument to hubris and quite possibly a solid example of the projection you accuse others of.

I can't wait for the time when a new super intelligent alien race comes on earth and exterminates us all because to them we look just like a bunch of lichens under a rock. That's definitely the way to go.

Yeah; until then are you going to stop using mouthwash? Stop washing your hands? This is just a silly conversation.

That depends. Could it increase the possibility of discerning the existence of extraterrestrial life and of being able to study it in it's natural habitat if I don't?

But it's really not a silly conversation. You are comparing (assuming it exists) the only extra terrestrial life we have ever found. Literally alien life.

Mouthwash bacteria doesn't mean a thing when you kill it because it's bacteria and it originated on earth. Bacteria that originated on Mars would be completely different as we'd study it for years just to find out how it originated and survives.

We don't even know they are there to begin with. I am all for proceeding carefully, but you're arguing for a paralysis of ignorance.

No, it doesn't mean they're irrelevant, it just means your previous analogy is irrelevant.

"The human body contains over 10 times more microbial cells than human cells, although the entire microbiome only weighs about 200 grams (7.1 oz), with some weight estimates ranging as high as 3 pounds (approximately 48 ounces or 1,400 grams)." [0]

You would literally not be the same animal you are now had bacteria not helped you along the way.

[0]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microbiome

You would be dead without the bacteria you have to help you along. But I'm not sure how this relates to a planet where said bacteria, if they exist, are sitting at the top of the biological pyramid.

Yeah, funny thing "defending" bacteria. I guess my point is that very simple organisms can have large a impact (on us, given the anthropocentric view I'm replying to here). Viruses for instance.

In a vibrant ecosystem, sure. But Mars is a dessicated husk of what might once have been a green thriving world. These remaining bacteria/fungi/whatever are like bugs on a corpse. Not an ecosystem; a fragment of a perhaps once-complex ecosystem and worth study. But not anything that should prevent or delay exploration of a planet.

Hopefully :)

Though if we do put martian bacteria in reservations en masse, I call dibs on teaching them how craps works.

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