Comment by TeMPOraL | Hacker News Reader

Comment by TeMPOraL | Hacker News Reader

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I agree 100% with your comment; I think you described the issue very nicely, as opposed to just reiterating the "best minds wasted on making apps" mantra (whether or not it's true, and I believe it is).

> It's not as expensive as the actual wars we are fighting, but it's not too far off either.

It's not that much different as people may think. What the real arms race and marketing have in common, is that they're at their essence a bare, exposed* positive feedback loop. Marketing done right seeks to cancel itself out; if two competing companies do their marketing in an optimal way, it will leave the customer in the same state as if no marketing effort ever occured (ok, maybe a little more tired from listening to all that crap, but otherwise his/her decisions will not be influenced). In doing so, it can in principle use up (i.e. waste) unbounded amount of resources. That's why I sincerely consider marketing to be a parasite and a plague of our times.

You know one other thing that work in the same way? Political campaigns. Each year each side hogs up more and more resources for their campaign, but done right, they just cancel each other out, ending up providing zero value for all the resources^ wasted.

So yes, I strongly believe we have a problem here.

* - think about looking at a bare, exposed core of a working nuclear reactor. Not fun.

^ - I keep using word "resources" instead of "money", because the latter invokes some weird brain failure modes in people, that make them think there's no problem here. Positive feedback loops like those don't waste abstract numbers, they waste energy, fuel, mined resources, paper, human time and human lives, and screw up our planet even more than it is already.

> if two competing companies do their marketing in an optimal way, it will leave the customer in the same state as if no marketing effort ever occured

Marketing covers more than this. It isn't just how the pie is divided up, it is also about increasing the size of the pie.

In fact, if it increases the number of potential consumers, marketing can be rational and profitable even if it reduces the market share of the marketing company (50% of 10 consumers is less profitable than 40% of 100 consumers). There is a real rising-tide-raises-all-ships effect, especially in discretionary goods (eg, jewelry, many electronics, financial services, the list goes on).

> Marketing covers more than this. It isn't just how the pie is divided up, it is also about increasing the size of the pie.

Yes, but the size of pie is bounded, and at some point you hit the limit of customers you can reach (most companies service local population) and/or limit of the market (there are only so many people with enough discretionary income to afford whatever you're selling). Then you're back to fighting for division of pie.

It's not really increasing the size of the pie: consumers only have so much time and mental energy. The growth of marketing just represents capital helping itself to a bigger share. As the number of consumer choices grows, the amount of effort demanded of them as utility-maximisers increases exponentially, as do the stakes.

> Marketing done right seeks to cancel itself out; if two competing companies do their marketing in an optimal way, it will leave the customer in the same state as if no marketing effort ever occured (ok, maybe a little more tired from listening to all that crap, but otherwise his/her decisions will not be influenced). In doing so, it can in principle use up (i.e. waste) unbounded amount of resources. That's why I sincerely consider marketing to be a parasite and a plague of our times.

I am wondering what would be the impact of a law to limit the advertising budget of companies. I will be hard to apply it, but the goal is to force companies to get out of the Nash non-optimal equilibrium that forces them to spend resources on marketing just because if they don't, the competition will.

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