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Comment by rick888 | Hacker News Reader

"I am asking because I have a bunch of friends in Europe and none of them lives with parents. As far as I can tell, their social programs make it much easier to live on their own than, for example, in my home country (Uzbekistan)."

Why do we need social programs to live on our own? I am 28 and have been on my own since I got out of college. I was able to find a job within 6 months of graduating that paid me enough to move out (which isn't that expensive in most parts of the US).

I think the reason many people in their 20s can't move out is because of credit card debt. I have so many friends that are thousands of dollars in debt..because they decided they needed the latest gadgets.

What we need is for more people to take personal responsibility.

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Because it is really helpful for a young person to know that you are protected in case of serious illness, that if you want to have kids, they will be socially protected which means that they will be able to get good education, health care, educational trips and so on without you paying ridiculous premiums, fees and getting into huge debt.

It is also really nice to know that the government will take good care of your parents after their retirement. That they will be able to pay bills, travel, get medicare, etc.

When this basic stuff figured out, young people feel safe.

That said, there is another interesting problem here: when young people feel safe they may become too lazy. And when people get too lazy, society starts to stagnate which is, as far as I understand, a huge problem in some european countries. But that's a completely different thing to discuss.

It's nice when you are born on second base... Unfortunately, you think it means you hit a double.

I have a friend who lived off of pell grants and loans to make it through a degree. He did not have the aptitude for math or science, and came from a very poor family (his father, at 80, still works at a Burger King.) He did not have connections from his family. He did not have any of the life lessons on how to survive in a middle class system.

He ended up graduating, and could not find a job of any sort. It's quite possible, had he grown up white, straight, and middle class, that he would have been fine.

He tried to go back to school, thinking that this would be the answer. (After all, it delayed loan payback.) In the meantime, he did what he was able to do: sell drugs. He went to graduate school and sold drugs because he couldn't gather the money to move, he couldn't get a job, and he didn't have options that we with privilege do.

It's fun to laugh at the whiny white kids who rack up college credit cards and have to stay at home, but personal responsibility only goes so far.

(PS -- my friend now has a drug conviction, a risk he ran because of one of the choices he made to survive. He now has even fewer choices.)

> I have a friend who lived off of pell grants and loans to make it through a degree. He did not have the aptitude for math or science

Then why did he go to college? Why didn't he work and go to a community college?

Making excuses for him only allows him a pass for personal responsibility, as if selling drugs was his only option -- ha!

Considering that he was unable to get a job after a full college degree, how much do you think a community college would have helped?

He Couldn't Get A Job. The path that he had been told was that education was the key to getting out of the ghetto. He Still Couldn't Get A Job and now he is in a worse position than when he started.

But we largely live in a consumer society where we are constantly bombarded with messages to 'buy! buy! buy!' Is it any wonder that lots of people fall for the messages? Especially when you have entire companies full of marketing people all trying to figure out a way to convince you that you need their clients' products.

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