The Three Christs of Ypsilanti (2013) | Hacker News Reader

The Three Christs of Ypsilanti (2013)

damninteresting.com

50 pointsmr_tyzic14 comments

I would highly recommend that anyone who finds this interesting read the book by Rokeach (there's a good, cheap edition from NYRB that I buy a lot of people as a gift) -- goes into far more detail, particularly with respect to the medical aspects.

It's also a great case study to demonstrate the falsity of the idea that there's any rationality to delusion -- the mind routes around thinking critically about true delusions in a fundamental way. It's not possible to reason your way out of a delusional state.

I read Rokeach's book a good few years ago, and found it more interesting for the incidental detail than for the larger narrative or for drawing conclusions from.

As the article notes, as a "scientific" experiment, the methodology was badly flawed, and the narrative (as I recall) is impaired by the repetitious and somewhat theory-laden recounting of the trajectories of the inmates.

Nonetheless, as you say, it's worth reading for anyone whose interest is caught by the article. I'd also recommend another book I read around the same time, Operators and Things [1], which is at the opposite end of the spectrum from Three Christs, having been (apparently) written by someone visited suddenly by clinical paranoia about that experience; it's strong on narrative, weak on clinical detail, quite possibly fictional, and with perhaps a more cheerful ending.

[1] http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/761935.Operators_and_Thin...

Never imagined I would see an article involving Ypsilanti on HN.

Agreed, especially concerning that creepy old hospital..

Same here. Have lived in Ypsi for many years and learned of this study and book a few years back. Absolutley fascinating though very unethical study.

Btw, the site was bought by Toyota years ago and the hospital is long demolished.

Whenever I read of messiah delusions I'm reminded of this short story:

http://squid314.livejournal.com/324957.html

What was done to those patients seemed incredibly cruel. It's one thing to have the patients confront each others' delusions. It's quite another to cause them distress just to see what happens.

>What was done to those patients seemed incredibly cruel.

compare to lobotomy, electric shock and other things that were "normal" back then? Not that i disagree with you, just putting in perspective.

The author came to agree with this over time:

"Rokeach came to think that his research had been manipulative and unethical, and he offered an apology in the afterword of the 1984 edition of the book: "I really had no right, even in the name of science, to play God and interfere round the clock with their daily lives."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Three_Christs_of_Ypsilanti

It's poignant how he inadvertently mentions four gods, then realizes that he was the fourth.

> What might happen, he wondered, if a psychologist were to deliberately pair up patients who held directly conflicting identity delusions? Perhaps such psychological leverage could be used to pry at the cracks of an irrational psyche to let in the light of reason.

> Over time, each Christ cultivated new delusions to retain his claim to godliness.

somehow not surprising seeing how people in general defend their irrational psyche - ideologies, believes, superstitions, etc... - from the light of reason. It is just a theory which will trickle down by God's will, i guess.

This was a very interesting read, but I feel too groggy today to pull out an appropriate conclusion--especially since, in the author's own words, this was a useless study that did neither the patients, nor the scientific community, any good.

Let me rephrase that: What impact on psychology did this study have? Is it solely noted today for influencing some laws protecting the subjects of psychological treatment/research, or did it end up benefiting the scientific community in some way?

Whoa there. As a past inpatient of a psychiatric hospital, I can tell you that respecting the human rights of patients is the number one area of failure of the psychiatric "community". As such, increased respect for the human rights of patients is not to be sneezed at.

As far as benefit to science is concerned, things don't look good on that front. Psychiatry is essentially a state-sponsored pseudoscience, concerned far more with normative behaviour and social control that with understanding mental illness. It's an unpleasant field to work in, with the result (I suspect) that only the stupid or unfortunate in the medical professions end up there.

(Richard Bentall's books are a good place to start if you want a balanced, "evidence based" and intellectually rigorous perspective on the field.)

Reply on news.ycombinator.com