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Comment by lispm | Hacker News Reader

A watch which does need charging once a day with a special charger, which is not very robust, very clunky, with a UI for kids for 350+?

No way.

Apple targets the fashion market. Material might be great, but the form factor is horrible: big, clunky, ...

Basically Apple tries to sell a very tiny computer add-on in a jewelry case.

Currently I'm only using watches for training a Garmin 310xt and now most of the time a Suunto Ambit2 S. The latter is the more modern and it does the training stuff very well. I can swim with it, it has GPS and it has very good heart rate monitoring functionality (it gets the oxygen consumption and energy using heart rate variability data).

For Apple I would hope that the new Apple Watch is the equivalent of the first iPhone, which also wasn't very good on the hardware level (slow, limited connectivity, ...).

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I don't know how accurate Apple's method for monitoring the heart rate is but it's definitely cool that I don't need to use a chest strap. That said knowing about my oxygen consumption and heart rate variability during swimming exercises is pretty amazing, I highly doubt the optical Apple sensor would work in that environment. So that Suunto Ambit2 looks neat indeed, thanks for sharing.

Optical sensors currently don't give that data.

So far only chest straps deliver that data.

Most oximetry is performed optically, actually[1], and it is the technology Apple is drawing from to determine heart rate[2]. It's not difficult to build an oximeter[3], though reliable and calibrated O2 sat[4] numbers may be more challenging to derive from a device in the form factor of a consumer watch.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse_oximetry

2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photoplethysmogram

3. http://www.swharden.com/blog/2013-04-14-simple-diy-ecg-pulse...

4. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxygen_saturation_(medicine)

Might be, but none of the training watches on the market with optical pulse sense offer something like that, AFAIK. If it also would work under training conditions is to be seen.

I'd love it if the first generation Apple Watch had an oximeter. But I don't think it will (despite all the sensors on the back). The reason is the FDA. Measuring your pulse rate is something that has been done for centuries if not millennia. But pulse oximetry is very recent, and the bureaucrats are willy waving to show that they're in charge. See e.g. this article that discusses the topic. http://mobihealthnews.com/29956/building-the-case-against-ap...

How is Ambit 2S at monitoring HR in water? Don't you need the strap for this?

From the canonical source of all questions fitness watch related: http://www.dcrainmaker.com/2013/04/suunto-ambit2-review.html

> Note that the ANT and ANT+ transmission protocols that the Ambit2 utilizes to transmit heart rate don’t transmit well underwater (about 1-2”), thus, you won’t get any heart rate data.

I believe Polar's ultrasonic sound transmission is still the only one which works reliably underwater.

The Ambit2 S does not do that. The new Ambit3 does it though. The strap works underwater, too. It buffers the data and sends it later when bluetooth connectivity is back...

"UI for kids"

Haha that's made my day thanks. Very witty.

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