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Comment by masklinn | Hacker News Reader

> Does this have to do with the predominance of credit cards in the US otherwise (a relatively uncommon mode of payment where I live)?

Likely, and the same problem exists in European countries with significant CC[0] penetration (e.g. France, or Iceland where cash marks you as a tourist and I've seen people buy a single packet of gum on card): you have to request a quote from a payment processor, the first link I get (EMS) tells me to "request an offer or contact the sales team".

[0] leaving it for posterity, but I actually meant "cards-based payment" rather than "credit card": the payment processor issue applies to both. It is true (in my experience) that euro countries tend to use debit cards rather than credit cards.

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Is it really that common to payment with credit card in France? I'm assuming that's only the case in Paris? I regularly buy stuff on card, but always debit if I can help it, and I would assume that that's also the case in the France.

I grew up in The Netherlands and I'm living in Italy now, and credit cards are generally viewed with suspicion. I didn't get a credit card until a few years ago when I needed one to live in the US.

A lot of people that I know are uncomfortable with credit cards. I'm guessing that's because they're associated with fraud; banks here don't make it easy to file reports in general. My card was used fraudulently for the first time a few months ago and it took A LOT of paperwork for my bank to accept that I hadn't made the purchases.

I've always wondered if it's a coincide that Paypal, Square, Google Wallet, Apple Pay etc. are all US-based, or whether it's because they don't address a significant pain point this side of the Atlantic.

I can assure you that CC payments in France are everywhere (and not only in Paris). I also regularly travel to Italy, and agree with you: Cash is preferred once you cross the border.

> Is it really that common to payment with credit card in France? I'm assuming that's only the case in Paris? I regularly buy stuff on card, but always debit if I can help it, and I would assume that that's also the case in the France.

France doesn't really make a difference between "credit card" and "debit card": it's essentially an implementation detail of your card's contract, the former is called "deferred debit" and the latter is called "immediate debit" (or "direct debit").

I believe the latter is indeed much more common than the former (and the default), but even it can have credit-ish characteristics in the form of overdraft (with variable depth and interests, and banks may waive part of the overdraft fees under a certain amount, mine did when I was there).

My point was more about card-based payments in general (as opposed to cash, bank transfer or cheques) than specifically credit-card and cards are definitely extremely common in france (though not absolutely ubiquitous).

CCs are not popular in my part of Europe because they're effectively shark loans. you get smacked by the bank for withdrawing money (high interest rates), you get smacked by the bank for not withdrawing money (high fees that only go away if you withdraw). either you have the money and then you don't have to borrow from the bank (and pay through your nose), or you don't have the money and then using a CC is a short road to forfeiture.

Just a slight correction, it's debit cards that are common in France and not credit cards. But yes indeed, at least in Paris, a lot of people buy everything with debit card (you can buy as low as 1€ by debit card in big chains).

Yes I really meant "cards" rather than specifically "credit cards". An AFAIK France doesn't really make a difference between debit and credit cards, that's a concern between clients and their banks.

Its also a concern btwn the end user and the card. Credit cards, bc of the inherent line of credit and their ability to accommodate you into a large amount of personal debt, free the end user up to become a consumer beyond their means. Debit cards don't. I think a lot of what you're talking about, in terms of payment issues in the US, stem from this.

We're spending money that hasn't been earned yet, and there is a lot of space to disrupt that as the industry is held by legacy companies who give out credit.

> Its also a concern btwn the end user and the card. Credit cards, bc of the inherent line of credit and their ability to accommodate you into a large amount of personal debt, free the end user up to become a consumer beyond their means. Debit cards don't.

To an extent, overdraft is a thing on debit cards.

> We're spending money that hasn't been earned yet, and there is a lot of space to disrupt that as the industry is held by legacy companies who give out credit.

But Square isn't in that business, they're in the business of ferrying money between the consumer and the provider of goods and services.

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