Comment by Argorak | Hacker News Reader

Comment by Argorak | Hacker News Reader

I have multiple issues with this. First of all, depression through stresses and clinical depressions are very different and the introductory paragraph is extremely shallow, brushing all over this. Many mental issues can lead to a comorbide depression.

Secondly, being depressed and being suicidal are related, the first often comes before the second, but not the same. By putting suicide hotlines front and center, the impression is there, though.

I know multiple cases where "but I'm not trying to do me any harm" was an internal barrier not to seek help, although they were depressed. If you are seeking help because you are suicidal, that's already way too late.

Finally, it assumes that this is just an unfortunate side effect of startup life, without critically engaging with that statement.

If you are down for irrational reasons of in emotional flakey states, try to find contacts, post on devpressed, visit a professional. Even if you don't have a strong or lasting depression, this will probably help get more secure in your feelings again.

I'd have to agree, this strikes me as confusing situational depression with clinical depression.

When I was at my worst with my depression, by all objective measures my life was going just great - good girlfriend, lots of money, stable and interesting work. When I started receiving treatment, my life was by the same measures in much worse shape - had just gotten fired from a job for non-performance (due to a total inability to concentrate, as well as the lack of motivation that usually goes with depression), was broke as broke can be, was having a lot of relationship problems and so on. With my neurotransmitters tweaked, I felt better while dealing with very difficult circumstances than I ever did with untreated clinical depression and an otherwise-easy life situation.

I am not trying to dismiss the emotional turmoil that people no doubt experience in stressful and uncertain circumstances like starting a business, but I think it's important to understand the difference between that emotional state and the sort of irrational utter despair that people suffering from mental illness feel. I think the tools needed to address each problem are likely to differ significantly - no amount of therapy or reading r/GetMotivated (bizarrely linked in the article above) would change the fact that I was experiencing the effects of what was most likely a physical ailment.

Thanks for writing this. I agree, bad feelings and anxiety are not necessarily "bad" if they are coming from an external source, meaningful source. Finding the line is hard, especially as those suffering from an illness quickly find sources if they are asked for.

The problem is that people who create startups tend to be highly analytical, logical, rational, intelligent in many facets with the perspective that their startup is their whole world and the whole world falls apart if their startup falls apart.

They are not the kind that can be helped by mental health care professionals in a traditional sense. Given the objective outcome, a mental health care professional can either reshape your world view (which I don't desire, because it's a ridiculous vocabulary I don't care to study again) or we can argue back and forth on theories about the human psyche, philosophize about various shared characteristics, and hope that somehow, abstractly, beneath this communication, lays something useful for the startup, code, math, logic, and so on.

The startup, the knowledge, the extending beyond the boundary of humanity TODAY is the goal. If you are completely alone in your life, then a health care professional can tell you objectively whether you are showering daily enough or not. They can not help you do research or build something new. Otherwise, I like the idea of having other people who have been through similar things to talk to.

It may even be possible that the person who created this is probably looking for a way to deal with their depression. People here are looking for perfectly unique solutions to perfectly unique problems. That's a difficult kind of depression to treat, if not impossible, theoretically, and I would say it runs a high risk of increasing the depression, unless the therapist happens to be one of these types themselves.

Do you have an understanding about the options mental health care has available?

It does not matter that people that create startups are logical, etc. This doesn't mean science-based medical health won't help. From what I have observed, mental health care includes things like medicines to help with inbalances as well as offering things like groups, help with stress management and coping skills for a person's situation. It isn't about changing your world view, it is about helping you not be miserable.

All of which are individualized to the person's needs as possible. 'Do what works and discard the rest'.

As far as 'extending beyond the boundary of humanity today' ... that's a bit diffficult to even think about if I'm having trouble convincing myself that I do, indeed, need to shower and cook food and go to work today. Research? Have to have concentration for that. The therapist isn't there to research everything, just to get you to the point that you can research yourself and help you if needed.

I was talking about people who have 'stress induced depression because they have huge goals and occasionally need to be strong enough to be their own motivation because it seems like begging for other people to tell them what they want to hear' mental thing. I didn't call it an illness, I only know that I've experienced it.

I can't ask people to tell me I'm going to be the greatest computer scientist just to get myself to code or learn something new every day. I just have to dedicate my life to it until I am proud of what I am and what I strive to be.

That said, the right medication helps. So can having people to talk to. I don't like paying to have people to talk to about my people theories, or explain category theory to, because that's what I wind up doing in therapy.

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