Hacker News Reader

Comment by jimktrains2 | Hacker News Reader

> Public discussion of education is always hampered by the fact that people not professionals in it have no sense of how complicated it is.

My friend's a teacher and the stories she tells me give me a glimpse into it. She's been in an intercity school for about 3 years now and so far, yearly:

* 3-4 of her students will be shot dead within a mile of their home or school * 10+ of her students will be in jail or in juvenile detention for a significant amount of time, usually on drug-related charged * 5+ of her students will have a child and miss a significant amount of time * 1-2 of her students will be pulled out of class and beaten by a rival gang

That doesn't even include the kids who work jobs, drug related or otherwise, outside of school to support their families.

Reforming education will be a side effect of working to improve society. Any attempt to reform education without looking at the environment the kids live in will fail.

View on HN

> 3-4 of her students will be shot dead within a mile of their home or school

I honestly don't understand how can the united states live with that level of violence, seeing by themselves that they are the exception in the first world.

The first step in solving a problem is recognizing that there is one.

I'm just as surprised as you are with these anecdotal observations, but I agree- there is a lot to be done to fix the issues, not the symptoms.

> I honestly don't understand how can the united states live with that level of violence

Because the people on this forum and the US in general, I would venture to guess, don't live in poor, gang-riddled communities and hence don't see this level violence daily.

I live in the same city and I've never seen it happen, only hear on the news and through people's discussions, because I don't _live_ in the parts she teaches in.

What's doubly sad is our crime rate has been going down since the 80s and 90s and is fairly low among cities our size (Pittsburgh).

That's not sad, it's a sign of hope that however bad it is now, at least it's getting better and not worse. We can't fix these problems overnight, but the efforts we make do make a difference, and someday these issues will be the subject of history books and not the nightly news.

The only time I ever hear about things like this is on the internet. A large majority of people would never experience these types of issues outside an urban environment. Most likely the 3-4 shot dead will be shot by another student or former student. Most urban areas have these problems and its bad in certain areas.

I'd invite you to visit America for some length of time before you make conclusions based on internet hype.

>I honestly don't understand how can the united states live with that level of violence,

The people causing the violence feel that it is the norm and most people in those communities do not help the police in any way or cannot (due to retaliation). You can only help someone if they want help, it cannot be forced.

The missing context here that no other comments have mentioned is that the violence in question here is almost certainly perpetrated by and against poor blacks. Race relations in the US--particularly those between the black urban poor and whites--are definitely not ideal. I'm sure you've seen media coverage of the Michael Brown shooting and related incidents.

It's a terrible situation that most people aren't motivated to do anything about because it, for the most part, only affects poor black people. The vast majority of Americans never experience any of this violence beyond seeing it in the news.

The missing context isn't race - the context needed was already there, being in the inner city and exposed to gangs. Simply put, the whole United States isn't like this because there aren't more black people across the entire country, but because the entire country isn't made up of inner city areas with high gang activity.

3-4 is probably an exaggeration, however, we live with it because almost all of us don't live it.

By that I mean the murder rates are only high in poor inner city neighborhoods. The crime levels disproportionately fall on poor minorities.

If you can afford to not have to live in those areas, it isn't a problem. And society doesn't care because it's someone else's problem.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com