Libor trial | Hacker News Reader

Libor trial

bbc.co.uk

59 pointshamdal14 comments

I'm so glad they're finally putting a whipping boy on trial.

Now, I know some of you are a little skeptical about the efficacy of punishing whipping boys, but let me explain. We can't possibly whip banking executives when they do something wrong because we live in a civilized society that respects the "divine right of banking executives". Instead, we assign each executive a whipping boy and the executive then develops a strong emotional bond to the whipping boy. When the executive does something wrong, he will be forced to watch his close companion, the whipping boy, suffer for his crimes.

This will act as an effective deterrent for any future wrong doing for the executive and send a strong message to other executives their crimes might jeopardize the well-being of their own whipping boys. Some may call me optimistic, but I think this single act of justice will have the desired effect of transforming our banking system. If bank executives know they're putting their whipping boys in real jeopardy, I think that will force their hand to rethink their organization's incentive systems and institute checks and balances into their organization to reward honesty, transparency and compassion.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whipping_boy

Bankers are being tried, see, for instance: http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/02/13/uk-iceland-bankers-...

I can't tell if you're being funny or not. If you are, well played. For those who don't get the joke, Iceland was really on the verge of collapse and took extraordinary measures to save their economy. If you did what they did in the US or UK, you'd be labeled a communist. Basically, Iceland's reaction to the credit crisis is the complete antithesis of what has happened in the rest of the world.

While I'm vastly amused by your post, the whipping boy isn't a good analogy. As the people on trial are the ones that actually execute the orders, it does act as a deterrent.

> The court was played a clip where Mr Hayes said he was part of a system in which influencing Libor was "commonplace", although he admitted he was a "serial offender".

Even if you only put 5% of these guys in jail, its still enough of a risk some people might choose to be honest.

You're right. My whipping boy analogy is a bit leaky, especially if one tries to project it the specifics of this case.

Here's my concern: Employees work under incentive structures that are established by their employers and are supervised by the executive teams. When breaking the law becomes "commonplace" in a system, the people who are responsible for governing that system must be held accountable if the negligence verges on criminal.

As a society, it's critical we have a reasonable legal framework that strongly encourages executives to make sure they have effective internal controls to detect and discourage criminal activity from employees. If we don't have that, then we're effectively giving executives whipping boys who can be used to shield them from the bulk of liability.

So what is your theory about this?

That the (whip boy) trader was executing trades as ordered by his (master) superiors in his own name, i.e. taking all the risk, but sharing the profit?

I don't think one has to order people to break the law. I think it's easier to establish aggressive incentive systems that encourages employees to act very single mindedly. I also think it's easy to undermine internal controls by putting incompetent people in charge who are easily intimidated with bad performance reviews.

It sounds like the trial will focus on Mr Hayes, but this was only possible because of the collaborative effort of other banks. His co-conspirators should be tried as well.

Of course, it is going to focus on him; it is his trial. However, the article says:

The first criminal trial . . .

So, it sounds like there are more to come.

I believe this is a test case, as it's not entirely clear if manipulating libor was against UK laws, as they were at the time.

There's a whole network of nasty crooks behind this. I demand more blood.

http://graphics.wsj.com/libor-network/#item=Hayes

if any hacker wants to help disrupting the banks: http://mapthebanks.com/

FYI this is a project by https://opencorporates.com/ (the largest open database of companies in the world).

this trial will change nothing; whole financial system is a circus of stupidity. the "scandals" will never end. people will always try to game the system and that's normal. this guy is basically on trial for not being ethical.

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