colin_jack

?

Maybe off topic but I've been wondering whether many people are finding spending time on TS worthwhile?

Given the improvements in ES6, the fact that the JS community in general is so active, and the fact that I've seen some truly awful TS code (mainly where the devs want to pretend the web doesn't exist) I've been put off exploring TS too far much (beyond looking at the basic language features).

I'm not sure if I should be rethinking though?

The URL itself provides a certain amount of location decoupling, and you can add in redirects to help with that.

Temporal coupling aspect I also find to be misleading, you can for instance use an ATOM feed (or equiv) to record events, its then up to clients to use them as appropriate.

Yeah when this game came up before someone pointed out one of his other games was:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Rigs:_Over_the_Road_Racing

Sorry yeah I get that, but in what way?

I'm not sure I really buy it, if you want to use the libraries/frameworks others are using that's easy, there's plenty of content out there that pushes you in the right direction. You can also take a punt on a framework/library that hasn't been maintained, or doesn't seem to have much interest, but that's your choice.

"I realized that if you miss generics in Go, your code is trying to cope with too much."

Was wondering what you mean by that (not disagreeing just interested)?

I see his argument about being primarily about the future, that as the standards fill in the gaps investing in libraries will become less of an attraction.

Don't forget he was part of the REST/ROA group who were belittled when they said that Web standards were an alternative to the ridiculous number of Web Service standards and he was quite right in that case.

I agree with the other replies but when you talk about learning from Rails, I agree. I also don't think using Rails is a bad idea. However I find the idea that if you don't use a framework to literally force you down a path you're on your own, that chaos will be dogging the project, that you end up with massive re-invention, to be incorrect.

Rails is also a bit of a special case I think, it was a massive ecosystem that dominated the community it was in. That isn't true of any JS client-side framework right now so choosing one isn't necessarily a sensible investment when you look 3+ so years out.

Get you, I think that relying on a framework to teach you that is a problem. Once you've used or researched one or more frameworks in an area you learn the successful patterns (right down to file/folder/test/method naming). At that point the whole enforced structure can be a disadvantage.

"This means new developers can get ramped up quickly"

Agreed that is an advantage of frameworks, but is it not more of an argument for a mature framework like Rails, rather than the current JS frameworks which appear and become (essentially)obsolete/niche in a year or two?

Are you assuming libraries don't though?

Yeah that's my attitude too, Ember scared me away because of the kitchen sink approach and the fact it introduced lots of new abstractions that I hadn't seen proven elsewhere, and that didn't really seem to me to be what I would be expecting from a Web framework.

Something like React bothers me far less as it smaller, less imposing, and solves real problems I've seen with other frameworks (for example by pushing clear/consistent/simple communication paths).

Well no not really, he says:

"The fundamental idea is that frameworks aren't needed, use the capabilities already built into HTML+CSS+JS to build your widgets. Break apart the monoliths into orthogonal components that can be mixed in any combination"

Also this is a man with a very rich history in terms of the Web and Web standards so writing him off without giving what he is saying any real attention seems silly.

Yeah the lack of any successful JS rich Web apps proves this point.

Wait, what....

This sort of attitude worries me, you don't need to use a framework to get this, you just need developers who have some knowledge of design/architecture, or who are the sort of people who will do research to find out.

I honestly think the framework enforcing architecture idea is more of an anti-pattern, even if you do use a framework you need to keep in mind that it wasn't built directly to fit your needs and that you may want/need to move in 6 months or a year.

You have a point, from my perspective though the difference between a light-weight framework like Backbone and one like Ember is almost as big as the difference between say Backbone and jQuery.

I'm not sure they are immediately comparable, the level of change in the JS side has been massive.

I'm also not sure the utilities libraries will be copied from project to project, for example if you developed a utility library and were using Ember its quite likely the Ember abstractions would have impacted the library design. If you then move to say React..

What, this guy you mean:

http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc5023.txt

Yup, also a good reminder that you need to constantly question the design decisions as you go (on an almost daily basis).

I guess the key bit of the article is:

"These frameworks work well for highly interactive apps with complex user interface requirements. We only needed a small piece of what a full framework would offer."

As you say its a tradeoff...

I have to say I was expecting a bit more than him just spraying a big dirty tag on the side of the building. Pretty lame and costly for the museum to deal with.

I wouldn't tell them to ever take their socks off, the only rule in our house is no shoes in the house.

Agree socks might not be 100% clean but you have to draw the line somewhere, and the bottom of a sock is bound to be cleaner than the bottom of a shoe.

You keep your socks on so that's not really an issue. I personally don't let anyone wear shoes in our house, I don't know what they've stepped on so I don't want them dragging anything over the floors and carpets.

"Continue smearing poop on your butts, heathens."

It is odd that whilst we use specially designed water jets and cleaning products to bathe our approach to bottom hygiene is just to keep scrubbing till there is nothing visible left.

Anyway looks like a good device, thanks for the link.

I don't agree, he's raising exactly the sorts of issues many householders would have. Even just the cost and hassle of redecorating/retiling would put most people off.

For me its Sublime and Chrome Dev Tools.

> This is essentialy the same as: Minister of health is not a surgeon.

Its more that she doesn't even know what a surgeon does but thinks you can train a surgeon up in a day.

> Sochi (the winter games) look good

What with the homophobia and corruption scandals I doubt that's even possible anymore.

As with F1 races, the article seemed interesting at the start but quickly bores the heck out of you.