igetspam

He addresses this in the comments and confirms that he got it wrong.

It does. See my comments above about the pain though

I used to feel this way but the cloud version seems to have gone the opposite direction in recent years. Don't get me wrong, there's still some complicated config you can do but my new gripe is that there are parts that are too limited.

100%!

The unit of tracking for how we think of things is some highly overloaded version of "project" which could mean project or team or org or repo or short lived event plan or anything else. Our terminology is probably wrong and it forces the way we think about the problem. It very much feels like a "everything is nail shaped" situation and we want everyone use the same model hammer. Jira, for all it's faults, does offer two or three different ways of doing work (with the recent addition of their DevSecOps thing that I haven't actually looked at).

Tasks != Bugs != Requests != Roadmaps

This was my take on ClickUp too. Lots of promise but not yet usable.

When you have infinite resources and a propensity for NIH, you can do a lot. GUTS is far superior to most ITIL projects but it will never see the light of day. It wasn't always good though. It was Remedy first and it evolved slowly away from it. I can 100% promise you that in 2006, bugs was actually probably the worst bug tracker I'd ever seen. In 2005 it wasn't and then it was. It took a lot to turn it into something useful.

Better is subjective. It's less flexible now and it's not perfect. It has arbitrary constraints that make things hard (no cross Jira project tracking, wtf?) but it's as good as anything else and it's familiar.

I'd say the automation is better but more complicated.

I feel bad for ZenHub. The new GitHub Projects is good enough that you can stop using ZenHub and not miss much. I think GitHub just killed their business. I love they cross project status automation they built. That's one of their killer features.

One of the things we struggle with is cross repo consistency. Take something like labels. They apply at the repo level and not the project level, so when you add issues from multiple repos, managing labels becomes an administrative task.

View creation is confusing and painful, due to the flexibility (which used to be a common complaint about Jira until they removed the many hundreds of options). People struggle to understand what comma does in the label list vs a space with a new label key/value.

Workflows are also per project and have to be replicated for every project and there's no global default template you can define.

Dependencies are non existent, so order of operations can't be defined in a way that's meaningful. You can order tasks but not indicate "dependency a is not complete and you may move on" in a simple way.

Task lists can't be reordered without editing the markup, which is finicky. If there's a newline it doesn't like, it errors. If there's a character wrong, it errors. Sometimes it just errors and you have to delete the whole thing and recreate it from scratch for it to render again.

There's no "move to top" or "move to bottom," which is necessary when you have long lista of items.

It's improving and if everything is a code, it's probably fine but when you're doing projects, some things are just tasks and it's not well suited for that, in my opinion.

I'm sure it will improve (as of last week you can limit WIP and export views as a CSV) but it feels so much like it's catching up, slowly, that I don't see it ever becoming a "good" alternative to systems that already exist.

I could list more but I'd have to look at my computer and there is already enough here that I'm just pulling from memory.

I have spent the last 14 years hating Jira. It's terrible software. It makes me angry to use, on a regular basis.

Know what though? I've used almost every other option in the last two years. They're all worse. We currently use GitHub Projects. Holy. Crap. It sucks so bad.

This truly is a Devil You Know problem. I challenge the software industry to make something better. Please. Seriously. There's good money to be had but bug and task track is apparently an unsolvable problem, if the goal is to make software people aren't mad about using.

Fi support is garbage. I've had so many issues. I'm busy and tired all the time or I'd have left. I hope the day comes where they shutter the thing adti finally have a forcing function.

She sounds adorable! Mine doesn't bite any more but there are still fits of uncontrollable emotion. They very much grok other people's feelings though and are quick with empathy.

Did you seriously include "won't cheat" or did you plant that there to see if people read this?

I want to downvote you for sentimental reasons. I won't but I want to.

Can you describe your bad vs good? I'm tussling with this right now and getting feedback can be difficult because of dynamics. Outsiders often have great feedback.

I can appreciate this. I can also appreciate your decision to disagree. One could argue that there are improvements to be had in our emergency call centers but having lived in both urban and rural environments, I feel confident that emergency services know how to get around most traffic problems. (Sometimes they'll just invent a hole.)

I'm not, not going to enable my kid to get a hold of me in an emergency. There's just no chance of that. I don't trust that the schools have this under control and (anecdata time!) the teachers I know don't really feel it either. Show me progress on school safety. Prove we're doing more than just theater. Then we (the royal "we," not you and I) can have a healthy discussion about use of electronics in a school environment. I don't _want_ my kid to have a phone at school, I just don't _trust_ that we're doing everything we can to ensure physical safety.

That's our plan. A simple device that allows for emergency use. Call mom, dad, trusted friend, 911. But our kid is young and limits are hard. As they age up, this will evolve.

I corrected my math. It's 93000 schools. One in 2500 kids will be at school during a shooting. That's 2500-${dead} that will likely suffer from PTSD. Know what people with PTSD often do? Hint: rhymes with suicide.

Phones in schools help in active shooter situations. They help responders know what's going on. They let children call their parents.

The article has links to unrelated studies and draws correlation without evidence to the author's conclusions. We have actual evidence that children have called their parents and that phones in hands have helped officers understand how things are playing out. This article and the personal accounts both here and there are unconvincing. Sure, social media is trash but I'm happy to deal with that on a personal level with my kid. There's nothing I can do to improve their safety at school though and that is something that school should be responsible for.

Is this the "math" you're referring to?

> I have a friend who is a high school principal and as the article describes, far more young people are harmed (up to and including suicide) by phones than guns. The sexting, constant and relentless bullying, distraction, overall device addiction, etc does far more damage to far more kids than guns (as wild as that might seem).

Or perhaps it's the "thousands of adults" seeing Dave Chappelle? The parent had no "math," only talking points. But here's some actual data:

46 school shootings in 2022

27 school shootings in 2023, as of May 5

There are approximately 93000 pre college public schools in this country. All but one school shooting has been at public schools. That means the likely hood of going to a school where a shooting will happen (using the 2022 numbers) is ~0.04%. Ask any parent if a "one in a 2500 chance" that their kid will be at school during a shooting makes them feel good or bad.

Is that good enough math for you? Let the kids keep their phones. In the not-actually-unlikely-event that there is a school shooting, more phones is better. Make schools, which are mandatory (not like airplane rides) safer and we can talk about phones. Focusing on less important issues, backed by anecdata (my school principal friend says... blah blah blah) is a waste of energy that could be used elsewhere.

You're not completely wrong but you're heading that way. Almost every public and private school in the country does shooter drills now. Kids who haven't been through a school shooting suffer PTSD. They are genuinely afraid that they'll die at school and this is a reality they hear from many adults.

What you mean to say is that not 100% of kids will suffer through a school shooting and that's true but I'll be damned if going to opt to remove phones from kids at school until the likelihood inverts, year over year.

School shootings are not like plane crashes, they are like plane hijackings by suicidal terrorists. (Because that's what they are.)

There are now kids who have loved through two school shootings. You're downplaying this significantly. Find a way to keep guns out of the hands of domestic terrorists and I'll listen to your concerns about phones but not before.

In the increasingly likely event that there's a school shooting, I want my kid to be able to call the police and me. I can't fathom an American parent not wanting their kid to have the ability to send an SOS any more.

And the "delete account" functionality appears to not work. That's also very disappointing.

No Linux support. How very disappointing.

You're missing a valuable difference: consent. If there are people being forced to compete the same way we force animals, that should be shut down too.

A similar thing can be said about those who see certain ideas as dogmatic. They're so resistant to hearing what the categorize as dogmatic thinking, they often can't hear good ideas.

User stories are great, when they make sense and the people reading them and writing them agree on the methodology. Agile is fine for those who like the model but so is (trigger warning: anti patterns being complimented ahead) waterfall. I prefer Kanban but it works well for my team I'm ways agile doesn't. I like it so much, I talk about it. I also like user stories but for a different use case: SLOs. Surprise! I subscribe to the SLOs.

Any of the things I just said could be portrayed as one form of dogma or another. It's only a bad thing when people don't align. When people share or at least agree to a methodology, they're great.

I do not need this. At all. Not one bit. Not for a second. It would be foolish of me to spend money on this.

Two, please!

Very cool.

Really? We had the opposite experience. We got the impression that sales loves to sell against their cloud. Probably commission related.

At my last org, we spent hundreds on confluent and then they did a pricing adjustment and our bill went up 4x. No exaggeration. We moves from kinesis to confluent because it was cheaper. After that, we moved back to save money.

This is brilliant! I've kicked around the idea but I've never taken the time to figure out the details. Thank you! I have so many devices lying around and some aren't even fit for women's shelters.