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johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

When someone flashes a knife and mentions $racist_slur -- or in the case of Israel, actually just arbitrarily kills people, turns off their water, blows up civilian buildings after posing for selfies, making all these sick videos playing with the children's toys of displaced or killed Palestinian families, attacks refugee camps even in the West Bank, just rips up roads, tears down shops with bulldozers, hands out weapons to utterly deranged settlers -- and then talks 5 hours about how they're a fan of African Americans or whoever they slurred, how much they like rap... you don't weigh these things against these other.

What could be weighed against it could be protest against and prosecution of the genocidal statements and actions. Nothing else, not ever.

There still are Israelis with conscience who are against this. But they're in the minority, as shown by Israelis demonstrating in front of the house of Ofer Cassir, tearing up a Palestinian flag with a scissor, grinning from ear to ear -- the first member of the Knesset they want to expel for supporting having this brought before the ICJ.

And there is the translate button. We can translate audio, too. Everybody speaks Hebrew. And whatever change in tune from here on out, while not changing the actions, will not change what Israel showed the world. Just like cutting off Internet access to Gaza will not make the world forget about Gaza.

But since we will simply not agree on this anyway, I want to ask, did you march with "Free Palestine", or with Palestinians? As in, in those 20 years, did you make Palestinian friends? If so, what are they saying?

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

Then replace "destroyed" by "conducted a raid in", or even leave it out altogether, and nothing about the point of that sentence changes.

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

Under the Genocide convention, Israel is obliged to prohibit and prosecute such speech. US senators aren't the standard, just like Hamas is not the standard. Besides one US senators hardly being the equivalent of hundreds of public figures, from the head of state to security and education minister, to army generals and so on. They're crazies alright, but they're not fringe, they're in charge. Those who call it out get viciously attacked, such as Ofer Cassif or Israel Frey ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zMKyH4jCnTE )

And the rhetoric matches the actions of the IDF. It's not "just" the bombing, it's also just blowing up whole villages demolition style, before/after making selfies and TikToks making fun of it. Just turning off water, plowing up the asphalts of streets, etc. etc.

johnnyworkeron Peter Thiel's Palantir to provide tech for Israel's 'war-related missions'

> "They are bombing refugee camps" Are there terrorists in these camps? Are there tunnels under these camps?

Nope and nope.

> "Making extremely cruel and deranged TikToks in destroyed homes" This is war... Soldiers have dehumanized their enemies since the beginning of time.

They're dehumanizing civilians, including children. The last time we saw something like this was Abu Ghraib, and they didn't post that proudly on social media.

> What is Israel's other option?

Than to target civilians to take over the land, and hiding that behind the fig leaf of Hamas which was always preferred over moderates? As Smotrich said recently: "In the context of de-legitimization - Hamas is an asset (for Israel) and the Palestinian Authority is a liability."

I don't have to provide an alternative to genocide, ffs. It is not a permitted response to anything.

> this is a fight for survival for both sides

Nope, it's a fight for expansion for religious zealots, and a fight to stay in office and not be on trial for corruption for Netanyahu. Israeli society doesn't gain anything from this. Once this fully trickles down and the fallout is over, it will take decades for Israel to recover from this, if ever.

johnnyworkeron Peter Thiel's Palantir to provide tech for Israel's 'war-related missions'

> Israel has gone out of its way to avoid civilians

What civilians? President Herzog said there are no innocent civilians in Gaza, as did many other politicians. IDF soldiers are singing about how there are "no uninvolved civilians".

Just turning off water TO PUNISH CIVILIANS isn't going out of one's way to not harm them. Or just sniping people out of nowhere, including a 70 year old woman with a white flag fleeing with a child. Or just shooting youth in the West Bank, then running over the body with an army truck.

You are telling us we didn't see what we saw because you don't face it. That's a fool's errand.

> "Those are animals, they have no right to exist. I am not debating they way it will happen, but they need to be exterminated"-- Yoav Kisch, Minister of Education, 09/10/2023

> "There are no innocent civilians in Gaza" -- Isaac Herzog, President, 13/10/2023

> “There is no humanitarian crisis.” [..] “the humanitarian crisis at the moment is in Israel.” -- Tzipi Hotovely, Israeli Ambassador to the UK, 16/10/2023

3 of hundreds such statements.

johnnyworkeron Peter Thiel's Palantir to provide tech for Israel's 'war-related missions'

Here are the broadcast and the the transcript of the first day of hearings:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G15NyemgYDM

https://www.icj-cij.org/sites/default/files/case-related/192...

johnnyworkeron Peter Thiel's Palantir to provide tech for Israel's 'war-related missions'

> 1. you can call the military and they will bomb and kill the terrorists but 20 civilians will die.

They are bombing refugee camps. Bulldozers are tearing up streets, just to make Gaza unlivable. Soldiers singing genocidal chants.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G15NyemgYDM&t=4548s

Making extremely cruel and deranged TikToks in destroyed homes. Politicians are talking about how there are no innocent civilians in Gaza. 80% of the people suffering catastrophic hunger in the world right now are in Gaza.

I'd rather say you and anyone has two options here: a.) denounce the genocide and call for it to end and the people responsible to be prosecuted b.) support genocide in some form or other, beating around the bush in so many words, with all sorts of neat hypothetical faces to put on the despicable genocidal underbelly that is being rubbed in our faces.

> All the anti Israel

To criticize that is as much "Anti-Israel" as the White Rose was "Anti-German". Yeshayahu Leibowitz didn't love Israel less than the people who saw no problem.

As Gideon Levy said, the friend of an alcoholic is not he who goes to the corner store to buy them alcohol, it's the one who tells them they have to stop.

johnnyworkeron UK and US strikes against Houthis under way in Yemen, say US officials

So you can't answer the question, instead of making it about me. Called it?

So, are you denying it? Here's IDF dancing chanting genocidal stuff. And what they showed is nothing compared to what's out there. As the SA legal team said, the refrained from shock value. Let me know if you need more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G15NyemgYDM&t=4548s

(isn't it "funny" how like 1% of the Western Channels that reported on Israel's "defense" didn't say a peep about the day before that? That's a matter of record now, too, another thing that won't be forgotten nor forgiven. The casual treatment people in Palestine like vermin, if not just collateral, was heard around the world. The people who are already tired of hearing that are in for such a rough ride.)

There's taxis and busses with genocidal slogans driving around. This goes way deeper than the prime minister, countless other ministers and Knesset members, IDF generals and IDF soldiers.

https://twitter.com/ireallyhateyou/status/174508838519726080...

Jason Hickel put it well:

> The US and UK are bombing Yemen, one of the poorest countries in the world, so that Israel can continue its genocide and mass displacement of the Palestinian people in Gaza without disruption. That's the reality we're in.

While Jason Cameron can't answer the question if turning off water is a breach of international humanitarian law because "he's not a lawyer".

johnnyworkeron UK and US strikes against Houthis under way in Yemen, say US officials

What does "war" have to do with dropping 2000lbs bombs in one of the most densely populated areas of the world, bombing refugee camps, stripping people in the streets, sniping a 70 year old women with a white flag and fleeing with a child, destroying streets just to make Gaza unlivable, singing about how there are no innocent civilians in Gaza, spraying demented graffitis in the homes of Palestinians that are either racist or religious zealotry? Politics? All that stuff is a result of personality disorders and group dynamics between people with personality disorders. The incapability to have empathy and the inability to reflect, the positive NEED to deflect every single time, talk about the other, talk about something else, is the one constant.

johnnyworkeron UK and US strikes against Houthis under way in Yemen, say US officials

I was just saying that there is no such thing as an insufficient counter-argument to something that can't even stand on its own. "People who say X NEVER say Y" is just.. nothing.

And when I "apply logic to the human world" there is not an instance in which I'm not fully "inside" the human world myself. Logic isn't some magical outside thing, and like conversation it doesn't have to be a means to an end.

johnnyworkeron UK and US strikes against Houthis under way in Yemen, say US officials

> You are nitpicking historical events.

In response to the straw man that people who criticize Israel never do so based on principles they apply to everything else as well, which warrants no response at all. It's not even worth taking note of at this point, it's just a square on a bingo card that got real old real quick.

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

As far as you're aware. Okay? What am I supposed to do with that? 2 seconds of googling yielded this:

> According to the Palestinian Ministry of Health, 26 out of the 35 hospitals across Gaza are non-functional because of damage sustained during the Israeli military assault or the lack of power.

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

> The UN is unfortunately not a credible source when it comes to this issue

This issue includes the second paragraph of the comment your replied to.

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

> With regard to the evidence for sexual violence, can I ask you what would be an acceptable form of evidence for you that doesn't include watching a video of a girl getting raped?

"not none" would be acceptable for me.

https://speakupeg.com/2023/12/30/nyts-disgraceful-investigat...

> “She said she then watched another woman “shredded into pieces.” While one terrorist raped her, she said, another pulled out a box cutter and sliced off her breast. “One continues to rape her, and the other throws her breast to someone else, and they play with it, throw it, and it falls on the road.”

If people accept that at face value from a party that calls people "human animals" and turns off water for civilians and all that, while prepping to take over occupied territory it doesn't even consider occupied but theirs, well.

> Also, with regard to the beheadings, I know this is uncomfortable, but it's worth looking into a bit more than you have. There is lots of evidence that would pass muster in any court.

If it would pass in court, you can link to it here. Because, again, so far it's been claims accepted at face value, then attacking those who ask for evidence (it's in the OP article even, someone asking for evidence being flagged as "terrorist/fake"), then still no evidence.

https://www.declassifieduk.org/beheaded-babies-how-uk-media-...

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

"the Earth goes around the sun, so this is not what you see with your own eyes" is not an argument. The declared aim is to make Gaza unlivable, the actions match it. Including just turning off water, talking about human animals. And the destruction is not "regrettable", it's a despicable atrocity.

And then there is the IDF just going into civilian buildings, villages, rigging them up and blowing them up, singing about moving into Gaza and all that. The idea that it's only about military targets does not hold a drop of water.

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

The Israeli extremist right-wing and its supporters and lobby groups aren't "the Jews".

Would you deny that, say, the Russian or US government are messing with social media, or media in general? Does that mean they "control" the media? Of course not.

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

> hamas supporters

If you have to label everyone who goes against the narrative that Palestinians are "human animals" that must to be wiped off the Earth, and other things Israeli politicians said while the IDF is doing it (or even just anyone who cares about factuality full stop) a Hamas supporter, that should tell you something.

As Bernie Steinberg said here https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2023/12/29/steinberg-weap...

> If Israel’s cause is just, let it speak eloquently in its own defense. It is very telling that some of Israel’s own supporters instead go to extraordinary lengths to utterly silence the other side. Smearing one’s opponents is rarely a tactic employed by those confident that justice is on their side.

The same principles that condemn the crimes of Hamas condemn the Israeli atrocities. It's really not complicated once you strip away all the labels of pro-this and anti-that.

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/12/21/al-shifa-hos...

> The bare, white-tiled rooms showed no immediate evidence of use — for command and control or otherwise. There are no signs of recent habitation, including litter, food containers, clothing or other personal items.

> “This room was evacuated, and all the gear was evacuated. I guess it was evacuated when they knew or understand that we were going to enter Shifa Hospital,” Hagari said in the video.

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

It's called "intellectual honesty". It's not a tactic, it's more like a strategy.

One crime doesn't justify or deflect from another. Simple as that. And to exploit the victims of the Hamas attacks to commit ethnic cleansing is not honoring them, it's really just exploiting them for jingoistic purposes, and to dehumanize all Palestinians. We've seen so much of that we won't forget for decades.

johnnyworkeron Israeli group claims it’s using back channels to censor “inflammatory” content

> Among a list of LinkedIn content that Iron Truth told its Telegram followers it had passed along to the company was a post demanding evidence for the beheaded baby claim, categorized by the project as “Terror/Fake.”

Just one instance of that is one too many in my books.

https://www.declassifieduk.org/beheaded-babies-how-uk-media-...

johnnyworkeron 95% of container ships are now going around the Southern Tip of Africa

As for the last paragraph, don't worry, when I read your reply I thought it's like you're giving me free pentesting for arguing a highly volatile issue. Thanks.

I know it's repetitive, but I don't think of it as being pro-Israel or being pro-Palestine. Especially since this right-wing messianic stuff paints Israel into a very, very dark corner. Blind support of it is helping Netanyahu and some very cruel and ultimately sad people, maybe some arms manufacturers, but not really anyone else, not even in Israel.

> displacement doesn't necessarily qualify

Not necessarily, but possibly. E.g. from Wikipedia on genocide:

> The term Bosnian genocide is used to refer either to the killings committed by Serb forces in Srebrenica in 1995, or to ethnic cleansing that took place elsewhere during the 1992–1995 Bosnian War.

Just scattering people in the world to never return, to settle their land, is destroying them as a national group in my books. But we'll see.

The bulk of the quotes I saw can basically be summarized as "we don't care, ethnic cleansing is fine, genocide is fine too, as long as Israel controls the land afterwards", and if anything beyond that is said, everything is blamed on Hamas, case closed.

That is bad enough, but that messianic stuff goes a farther than that IMO. When Netanyahu invoked Amalek, which he and others did more than once, that implies wiping out everyone, children and even animals, showing no mercy, blotting out their memory. And his reference to "fulfilling the prophecy of Isaiah"..

> "Destruction has been decreed, overwhelming and righteous. The Lord, the Lord Almighty, will carry out the destruction decreed upon the whole land."

I can't tell you what exactly Netanyahu means by that, but you'd have to squint harder than I am able to to not be pretty sure it's not within international law.

> "When there is absolute evil, one must not look back, one must not express empathy. The actions of the oppressors on Black Sabbath [meaning October 7th] are tens of times worse than the actions of Sodom and Gomorrah. The war is not about territory or Economy but a war for the loss of evil from the world and the perpetuation of the absolute good." -- Avishai Levy, Lieutenant Colonel and Rabbi of the Northern command, 03/11/2023

I do think we have tacit approval of genocidal statements, combined with the atrocities we know about, which in turn are probably just the tip of the iceberg. If the stuff people proudly post on social media is so sickening, singing "Gaza is a cemetery" and all that, obviously not fearing for their military careers at all, what are people doing that they don't film? We know enough to know it needs to be stopped and investigated, of that I'm confident.

johnnyworkeron [dead]

Why not just clone the repository, do sentiment analysis, and show us?

johnnyworkeron I found the music I love on the internet

Web radio stations from all over the world with a Google Earth like interface:

http://radio.garden/

(I don't know why it doesn't support https, maybe so they can embed streams from a gazillion random websites?)

johnnyworkeron 95% of container ships are now going around the Southern Tip of Africa

The Genocide convention doesn't say "you mustn't kill a whole group people all at once, at least 99% of them, everything else is okay".

> If Israel wanted to commit genocide then the entirety of Gaza would be leveled and 99% of the people dead indiscriminately.

No, that's how it is defined. Plus, they're clearly working on it.

https://twitter.com/JerryHicksUnite/status/17440291718508259...

That is a good short primer to just how far off it is to call this war or self-defense. And it's in the West Bank, too:

https://twitter.com/QudsNen/status/1744466142918238591

And the ethnic cleansing on the ground matches the genocidal rhetoric by politicians. Rhetoric Israel is obliged under the convention against Genocide to prohibit and prosecute, not engage in.

"Bring down buildings!! Bomb without distinction!! Stop with this impotence. You have ability. There is worldwide legitimacy! Flatten Gaza." -- Revital Gottlieb, Member of the Israeli Knesset (Likud), 07/10/2023

"I have ordered a complete siege on the Gaza Strip. There will be no electricity, no food, no fuel, everything is closed,” “We are fighting human animals and we are acting accordingly" -- Yoav Gallant, Minister of Defense, 09/10/2023

"Those are animals, they have no right to exist. I am not debating they way it will happen, but they need to be exterminated" -- Yoav Kisch, Minister of Education, 09/10/2023

"This [attack] is not enough, there should be more, there should be no limits to the response, I said it a million times, until we see hundreds of thousands fleeing Gaza, we, the IDF has not achieved its mission, this is a phase that should happen, I am saying this cause these are instructions that were said to the IDF" -- Yoav Kisch, Minister of Education, 09/10/2023

"I don't care about Gaza. I literally don't care at all. They can go out and swim in the sea. I want to see dead bodies of terrorists around gaza." -- May Golan, Minister for the Advancement of the Status of Women in Israel, 13/10/2023

"There are no innocent civilians in Gaza" -- Isaac Herzog, President, 13/10/2023

“There is no humanitarian crisis.” [..] "the humanitarian crisis at the moment is in Israel." -- Tzipi Hotovely, Israeli Ambassador to the UK, 16/10/2023

"Without hunger and thirst among the Gazan population, we will not succeed in recruiting collaborators, we will not succeed in recruiting intelligence, [or]... in bribing people with food, drink, medicine, in order to obtain intelligence." -- Revital Gotliev, Member of the Israeli Knesset (Likud), 23/10/2023

"We are the people of the light, they are the people of darkness... we shall realize the prophecy of Isaiah." -- Binyamin Netanyahu, Prime Minister, 25/10/2023

"One of the options is to drop an atomic bomb on Gaza. I pray & hope for their [hostages] return, but there is also a price in war." -- Amichai Eliyahu, Minister of Heritage, 05/11/2023

"We’re facing monsters, monsters who murdered children in front of their parents... This is a battle not only of Israel against these barbarians, it’s a battle of civilization against barbarism" -- Binyamin Netanyahu, Prime Minister, 24/12/2023

When you combine that with the gleeful cruelty IDF soliders are displaying in the videos they are making of themselves, the fact that over 30000 people have already been killed, thousands of children, half a million set to starve or die of disease in the next year, the targeting of refugee camps and journalists, the videos of snipers shooting at people out of nowhere, gunning down a woman fleeing with her child, gunning down youth just standing around in the West Bank, etc. etc. etc. the picture becomes clear and "it's not genocide because it could be worse" rings very very hollow.

Palestinians are declared as non-persons and just hunted, starved, bombed. And the attempt to do this before the eyes of the world and to sanctify it is the worst attack on Western civilization, enlightenment and human rights since Hitler was on the cover of Time magazine.

johnnyworkeron United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

Why not both? Am I missing something? You can have feedback loops and CI and all that, "good craftsmanship" or "good practices" (not "best" practices because those often suck hah), where of course opinions vary on the details of that -- and then someone who is also good at the craft who spends more or most time on helping the rest work together, i.e. manage/lead them.

johnnyworkeron Comics I Loved in 2023

Fair enough, and point taken. Thanks for taking the time to re-iterate it.

johnnyworkeron United finds loose bolts on plug doors during 737 Max 9 inspections

But that doesn't contradict the parent, does it? I'd say you both make good points.

johnnyworkeron Comics I Loved in 2023

I appreciate your effort, but I am citing him because he's put it very succinctly. As I said, that unrolls to many other people saying the same or worse things, many of them in the government.

And their words match the current military actions, the flattening of villages, the religious zealotry, the wanton attacks on civilians. When I referred to Abu Ghraib I wasn't trying to be polemic, that's just the best one-phrase description I can give of all the shit I've seen and read and seen justified.

> There's probably no side of this debate that thinks Smotrich is anything less than a monster

When it comes to Israel itself, thinking that these people are "monsters" isn't enough under the convention against Genocide. As for the rest, where are the calls to stop this? Where is even honest reporting on it? NYT is currently lying about "Israel scaling back the war", meanwhile:

https://twitter.com/muhammadshehad2/status/17443264624490293...

https://twitter.com/MiddleEastEye/status/1744351540435935525

Again, just the tip of the ice berg. Videos chosen for not being very graphic. Just enough to realize that the convenient, clean narrative put forward can't possibly be correct.

And the people who watch in horror and watch how it's swept under the rug, how the people scratch each other's back while having "concerns" (say, Biden delivering weapons, saying no to a ceasefire, while paying some lip service to being a nice human because that's all he has against Trump), how Palestinians are just treated as non-persons, vermin to be exterminated to take their land, while that is glorified with sombre references to the Holocaust, will never forget it.

Every time there is something about, say, the atrocity that was putting Japanese Americans into camps during WW2 (which it was), they will think back on how Palestinian children and civilians were blown to bits, starved to death, in the ten thousands currently, with the declared target being hundreds of thousands if not millions, and how their neighbors, friends and family, shrugged and said "their fault for voting Hamas 2006", and how the connection they felt to that person died that day. That's not an argument, but that's what will happen. It already happened. We don't know why people do this or that, just like we never will fully understand the Holocaust, but we know what they did, and that will have to do.

I'm not saying this to convince anyone. I can't convince anyone who isn't shocked about what I already posted and looking into it themselves. I try to stay on top of it, and I pass on some of the things I saw I see nowhere outside of the sources I stumbled onto by caring about and researching the issue. I like to think that makes it valuable enough, certainly as valuable something that contains no quotes and just rephrases justifications that are well known. When I reply to a person I haven't talked to before in a thread I haven't posted in yet, I might repeat a quote or a link, obviously. I don't have the time to come up with something fresh every time.

johnnyworkeron Comics I Loved in 2023

> This is what Israel has begun to do - we cut the supply of energy, water and diesel to the Strip ... But it’s not enough. In order to make the siege effective, we have to prevent others from giving assistance to Gaza ... The people should be told that they have two choices; to stay and to starve, or to leave. If Egypt and other countries prefer that these people will perish in Gaza, this is their choice.

-- Giora Eiland

> If we act strategically correctly, there will be immigration and we will live in the Gaza Strip. We will not allow a situation where 2 million people live there.

-- Smotrich

Two of dozens and dozens such statements, with rather tame language compared to others. Under the Geneva Convention the Israeli government is required to prohibit and prosecute such speech, not engage in it. And then there are is the actual murder, which in turn unrolls into hundreds of things, including soldiers incriminating themselves with a sort of "humor" that reminds of the cruelty of Abu Ghraib, plus "the Temple will be built soon" and all that.

Even outright targeting of journalists. https://rsf.org/en/israeli-politicians-call-journalists-gaza...

johnnyworkeron AI or Ain't: Eliza

You are talking about "comprehensive calculation indistinguishable from human judgment with the ability to include factors such as emotions". Even if that might be possible once we can fully compute all of physics (that in itself I wouldn't assume), that's just not what we're actually dealing with.