sleepingadmin

>The only reason this story exists is a bunch of conspiracy theories.

Unprecedented times being under martial law and the government saying they'll seize political opponent bank accounts. Conspiracy theories aren't even needed when it's publicly showed on the media's frontpage.

>If it happened any other time (and it does) it would be a normal network failure.

No other outage can be connected here. So we can't blame an AWS outage.

Can you to show ANY other time when Canadian banks went down together like this.

Hello Dang,

Sorry for offtopic. I dont know how to reach you otherwise.

I was flagged at: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30374970

Just curious what rule I broke this time?

And my post got flagged?

I wonder which rule I broke this time?

Does @dang work to ask a user?

>Don't they all use Interac for a variety of services including e-transfers?

Sure, but 1 thing going down doesn't take down your entire corp. That would be some extremely bad design.

Doesn't really explain all the major banks going offline at around the same time. https://twitter.com/AB_inmate/status/1494079461347643392

No conspiracy. This is just people reacting to the news they will be seizing the accounts of political opponents.

>Just get a cheap/free 3d asset pack from itch.io and go nuts. It helps to know some concepts about 3d like UVs, normal/AO/specular etc maps, triplanar mapping, vertex colouring etc. but other than learning a bunch of new words it's not that difficult. But making 3d assets yourself is super time consuming.

Oh for sure. I've been 3d modeling for years. I'm big into cad and 3d printing, I used to know blender decently until they moved everything on me in a recently big release. Really should have taught myself shortcuts lol.

>Though it may be fun, setting up a whole streaming platform and engaging an audience is a whole shitload of extra work on top of the actual gamedev, so if you have limited time best to really truly treat it as a hobby and squeeze in an hour or two on certain evenings or something.

Gotta pay the bills. Without those options, where does one make enough money?

>I love Godot BTW, here's my latest project in it: https://twitter.com/TetrisMcKenna/status/1486629669252313088...

<3 roguelikes.

>Your game sounds fun I hope I get to play it some day. If you do, please consider adding VR support.

Oh for sure, godot has that built into the engine I believe.

https://godotengine.org/article/godot-3-vr-and-ar-support

My big feature I would be supporting 100000% is BCI. Being able to play without keyboard/mouse/pad just your brain.

The game wouldn't be super serious. Kind of TF2 style where it's more casual. Robot's would pick between 'binary and non-binary' for their gender lol, tongue in cheek joking obviously.

I think there would be a factor of trying to build teams as well. Han Solo isn't Han Solo without Chewbacca. So obviously at least co-op to start.

But alas, as I said. On hold until a million $ lands in my backyard.

>Are we talking about the same 'this"? The logs say that you edited https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30361111 to replace the text with "Flagged" a few minutes after you originally posted it.

Wasnt me, I assumed I cannot edit my posts in relation to the downvote karma threshold thing. Like so I needed to prove my worth or something. I stand by my posts even if I was wrong. Just like I just was with my recent post about the definition of vaccine. I am wrong in my post. My brain definition of vaccine certainly included 'prevents infection' factor.

It's probably a problem on my end. I was missing the reply link when trying to reply to prohobo but now see it there. I cannot explain.

This post however was indeed fairly charged/hot post about social movements, the requirement to stay nonviolent, comments over the democratic party, trump, etc. I expected to take heat. I provided a link criticizing the democrats over their inaction of resolving an obvious problem in the USA. My post did take heat quite rapidly in that one.

I dont personally believe my comments were flamebait or trolling. I cannot see my original post any longer, maybe I did go over the line. So be it. Not to get religious, but:

“The past is already gone, the future is not yet here. There's only one moment for you to live, and that is the present moment” ― Buddha

Let's not waste on further time on the past. Doing so will solve nothing.

Godot has me so excited. Finally a good open source python(like) engine with all the bells and whistles.

I have only done the tutorials for godot. Not even trying to start my own project. The real caveat for me on video game programming. The programming isn't the problem. It has everything to do with 3d modeling, texturing, etc.

I kind of dream about starting my own video game project up using godot, stream on twitch/youtube making it so I could get some revenue going. Kind of what star citizen wanted to be, starfield will likely be, with my own take. Kind of a skyrim meets han solo meets the martian meets chess meets piano meets metasploit.

But I really hold back because family to feed, diapers to buy, mortgage to pay. Boring game dev streaming like that won't be paying those bills.

Sorry, can't reply to your other post again. Getting frustrated with HN today.

>There is some signal that it does affect reproduction, though not properly confirmed and definitely not to that degree. Anyway I agree, many people could take it to mean it sterilizes you.

I haven't seen anything that would suggest there is any possible symptom of fertility. Doctors should certainly be providing such risks as part of informed consent if true.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_vaccine_misinformatio...

Wikipedia very clearly defines it as misinformation. I don't know.

>To be honest, there should just be a proper forum to discuss these things where everyone is forced to agree on an epistemological basis then go from there. Otherwise there'll always be misunderstandings and shilling for whatever side.

I think the main problem is that things changed over time. That we came upon times where we didn't have any treatment for a disease and those producing the first shot that can help may have pushed things a little over the line.

Here we are at a point where it seems clear to me that we need to separate the terms. If I am wrong and vaccine will now include these, we need a new word for vaccines that do prevent infection.

Sorry, I lost even my reply button for your reply to my reply. I can reply here.

>"Sterilizing vaccine" is as good a term as any, IMO. >Maybe the takeaway is that the government and media has it's toxic influence in literally every piece of information we see, and to not trust a single thing anyone on the internet says. It's the misinformed vs. the disinformed at this point.

I understand your point. But I think we come up against a new problem with that terminology.

There is covid misinformation which suggests the shot is sterilizing your fertility. After the shot you can no longer have babies is the allegation. Obviously utterly false.

https://www.kxly.com/could-the-covid-vaccine-make-a-person-s...

>It's problematic to be pedantic about something that isn't true. A vaccine causes an immunity response. A therapeutic cancer vaccine is a vaccine because it relies on an immunity response, not because it prevents the spread of cancer. Vaccinations are often the best method of preventing a infectious disease but not all vaccines prevent contagion.

I am asking these other people what we should do. It seems your in the camp that it's fine to keep calling the covid shot a vaccine. This is fine with me. We simply now need a new term for the vaccines which do prevent contagion.

I suppose the actual word used is irrelevant. Can you goto https://www.wordgenerator.net/fake-word-generator.php and push the button 5 times and tell me what the new term is?

I will then say, the covid shot is NOT that $newterm. That I recommend everyone get the $newterm shots, but since the covid shot isn't $newterm... well...

>After reading all the definitions and articles about the meaning of vaccine and immunity, I think it's legit to call them vaccines.

This is a fair point but going forward perhaps we need a new term or at least requirement to differentiate the clear 2 different categories.

>The problem has been that the Covid vaccines are definitely not what they were advertised as in terms of efficacy (namely: stopping transmission and ending the pandemic).

Oh absolutely. You can find countless examples of mainstream media saying that the covid shot would prevent infection and then you never have to worry about it again and we can then reopen.

So what do you think we should do to prevent this borderline fraud?

>A vaccine doesn’t necessarily need to prevent infection to be called a vaccine, prophylactic vaccines are a thing.

Perhaps we need to discuss new terminology. Let's not discuss the point of view where immunocompromised people mean a vaccine doesn't work.

>The whole “they revised the definition” thing is itself revisionist history

I will concede this. I never said this in the post you replied to, but it is something I have said previously. I will admit I was misinformed or brainbroken.

I think the point stands however. IF there's a class of vaccines which prevent infection. These are different from a vaccine which basically does nothing more than tylenol.

So what should we do? Leave vaccine as a pretty weak word that includes prophylactic vaccines or do we redefine prophylactic vaccines to be something else?

>I interpreted your comment to mean "I flagged this submission," which would be breaking the site guideline "If you flag, please don't also comment that you did."

I don't have buttons to delete, edit, or flag, never did on my previous account neither. My understanding was that I do not have these as part of upvote threshold like being unable to downvote. Maybe it's my fault and some sort of addon doing something?

>Now that I've looked more closely, I realize that you actually originally posted a totally different comment and then effectively deleted it (by overwriting it with "Flagged"). Normally we ask people not to do that—you can use the 'delete' link as long as the comment has no replies.

I personally did not do this.

>In this case, your comment got one reply but the replier subsequently deleted it. This is a corner case. It might even be a bug in our software if the 'delete' link didn't reappear.

Well no, there was also another comment insulting me mostly. I dont recall the username. I wasn't planning to reply to that one. It was obvious that they were triggered by my comments about the democratic party. I didn't really intend to cause a fight over those comments.

I guess that Mikeouse has the right of the person who replied to me.

Thanks I guess, I'll move on.

>This shouldn't be downvoted, it's true.

I knew I would be when I posted. I accept the consequences of my post.

>There's nothing wrong with creating good drugs and therapies, and this looks cool, but if it doesn't stop transmission it's literally not a vaccine.

I have 2 shots, I believe in these shots, but misrepresenting them as something they are not has been dangerous. No doubt it casts shadow upon their value.

Hello Dang,

Out of curiosity, what rule did I break? I had a fairly long post.

I had people responding to me but I guess I can't respond to anymore?: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30361631

Mikeyouse said:

>And that idiotic CNN chyron was clipped to be troll bait for the credulous. If you honestly believe that's how the protests were covered, you should spend some time reflecting on where you get your news and who you trust.

This was in response to me posting: https://twitter.com/JoeConchaTV/status/1298863702272344064 and making comment.

This was in the context of my post explaining how non-violence similar to MLKjr and Ghandi is an absolute rule. That saying 'peaceful protest' while standing in front of cars on fire is a violation of the rule.

I feel this is a reasonable and fair discussion.

Does it prevent infection? If not, it's not a vaccine.

Flagged

Thought they died, nope just stupid birds. Sorry for being redundant, I could just say bird.

>Is HN becoming more of an "echo chamber"?

My previous account had people following me to downvote me and the occasional threats. This has much more to do with topics that you're not allowed to criticize. They would even follow to unrelated subjects. Got flagged constantly for no valid reason.

Created new account, no problem anymore.

>2. If yes[2], how big of an "echo chamber" you think HN has become (or is becoming)?

I thought so, but it would seem it's really just 1 main topic. this one side considers this an extinction event and therefore anyone who criticizes their movement is literally killing them.

>How wide-spread is this issue? Is it limited to certain topics only? If yes, what are those topics?

New one seems to have been created basically a day ago. Canada declared martial law in order to end peaceful protests. The far left commie antifa folks were even shocked and freaked out. Obviously right-wing disagree as well.

The problem is that Trudeau and the propaganda media have been smearing the protests as Nazis, Racists, Sexists, etc. It's to the point that Bill Maher started comparing Trudeau to Hitler. Then days after Bill Maher said this, he misuses the martial law emergency act. Worse yet, the wording in his speech mirrored Hitler's speech in 1933.

I dont think Trudeau is planning to be Hitler, I think he's only consuming the propaganda that his own 'government accredited media' is putting out.

The problem is... so is so many other people falling for this propaganda. Those people are calling on the police to break up the peaceful protests. Here we are though, first time during my life time ever being under martial law.

I have never invested in crypto before but sure as shit am now.

>I'm not sure what more proof I can provide that the blockades and occupation are both an unpopular and illegal.

Well you jumped into this conversation providing a link saying people are sympathetic to the freedom convoy but 'not to read into it'. I believe I have been fair in my discussion.

Popularity is fairly irrelevant. It was extremely popular to imprison japanese canadians during world war 2. The point of your right to peaceful protest is to ensure your grievances are heard. If the government wishes to ignore the protest and not respond, that's fine, you can keep on protesting. This convoy has been tremendously successful in their protest thus far. Their grievances are being heard.

As for the legality of the military occupation. I don't believe you have provided sufficient argument to justify qualifying it as a military occupation. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_occupation If you would like to justify this I am willing to listen. I would agree that a military occupation would be illegal.

Trying to suggest that some municipal bylaws make it 'illegal' is certainly not something even in the realm of being able to remove your charter right to peaceful assembly.

>These responses are non-sequitors and proclaim with confidence what will happen in the future (as though we have a crystal ball).

Lets be realistic here. My predictions are hardly crystal ball worthy. The more practical response to this declaration by Trudeau. This act or equivalent was deployed during the world wars. Which is appropriate. Trudeau's father deployed it during the october crisis but there was bombs and death occurring. There's reasonableness that can be debated with Pierre Trudeau's use. This misuse by Trudeau is what got them to remove that legislation and replace it enshrining the requirement to maintain human rights.

>This seems like a good time to stop engaging.

Here's the thing. Bill Maher got to associating Trudeau with Hitler and what Hitler did. There's an awful lot of those predictions today from the left and right wings. I haven't gone there. I have been trying to be reasonable.

If you think I am wrong with my predictions, I bet you think those predictions are even more wrong? Frankly, if my predictions are wrong, I'm headed that direction comparing Trudeau to Hitler.

>That's absolutely correct. If you're not violating noise limits, not parked illegally, and comply with the same laws as everyone else, you can ABSOLUTELY continue demonstrating. The Emergencies Act doesn't change that.

We seem to consume different news sources. It's remarkable to read responses today. Shock from the far-left to the far-right. This isn't political anymore. Here's a Libertarian socialist antifascist with 190k followers on twitter: https://twitter.com/VaushV/status/1493511896351211520

As you are aware, the emergencies act doesn't allow the government to really do anything different than what has already happened to this peaceful protest. It doesn't allow them to remove any charter rights.

What's about to happen will infringe the rights of the protesters. Under the act...

Compensation

48 (1) Subject to subsection (2) and the regulations made under section 49, the Minister shall award reasonable compensation to any person who suffers loss, injury or damage as a result of any thing done, or purported to be done, under any of Parts I to IV or any proclamation, order or regulation issued or made thereunder.

When Trudeau finally orders the protest to end and infringes their rights. The Crown will be paying significant compensation to the protesters.

>I hadn't thought about it that way, but it certainly would explain his actions. You don't compromise with nazis after all.

The question though, are these protests really what he has called them? Are they really a military occupation?

>This would explain a lot about Trump too. He was in a misinformation bubble as well.

100% true. You will find even republican ideologues have called him out on many of his bullshit things. Hell his rhetoric was toxic. Tons of improvement could happen over Trump.

>Which means even world leaders aren't immune to this tribal trap.

It's built into our psychology, but not something out of control. Harper was in power for 9 years and never called in the military. He never demonized his political opponents. He never falsely labelled a peaceful protest as a military occupation. He never smeared political opponents as 'racists and white nationalists with unacceptable views'. He never declared a state of emergency to crush dissent.

Trudeau doesn't need the military. He gave himself to power to seize your bank account because you're a protester. No court orders. No due process.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60383385

Deputy Prime Minister Chrystia Freeland said at Monday's news conference that banks would be able freeze personal accounts of anyone linked with the protests without any need for a court order.

>Of CPC voters, they're split on support of protests.

Erin otoole fell spectacularly. Peter mckay not only supports violence against the blockade, he applauds what Trudeau did last night. Piere Polievre seems to be the only reasonable position. We shall see what happens at their leadership.

>If you think a peaceful protest involves blocking access to ambulances and hospitals,

That hasnt happened here at all. That was something months ago that lasted for all of a day before the protesters willingly left. There have been absolutely no blockades like this at all for this. You are misconstruing different protests.

>defacing statues with swastikas

This absolutely hasnt happened. You seem to be consuming some very poor media.

https://www.newsweek.com/canadian-protesters-face-investigat...

But wait lets evaluate.

https://twitter.com/mackaytaggart/status/1487486909131677698

This is the defacement. Some Canadian flags. The protesters themselves came and cleaned this up after it came out.

Your comment that they have been defaced with swasitkas is wrong. So what about the swastikas? Lets be realistic, it was litrally 1 guy with a nazi flag and journalists coincidentally were able to follow him around to get pictures. Hence the media saying 'swastikas were seen'. In the end we actually discovered the truckers are quite diverse and there's absolutely no nazis amongst them. So frankly, if you're seeing swastikas, that's the counter protesters or journalists.

> and honking very loud horns non-stop for weeks, then I don't think it's possible to have an amicable conversation.

The narrative that these sikh and black truckers are white supremacists has fallen internationally. https://notthebee.com/article/come-and-laugh-with-me-at-the-...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWU8Bi8FqQg

This 'racist' narrative is mocked even by the left-wing. Though I concede that honking horns in downtown capital cities should be banned.

>I don't think your assessment reflects the current attitudes in Canada. With such a polarizing topic, it's easy to fall into a bubble. I think this is true (and fairly normal) for any political in-group--we tend to overestimate our public support.

I love reading /r/ontario and /r/canada. Obviously cant comment like I do here without getting banned from those subreddits. So their bubble literally sees the truckers as a military occupation that needs to military to violently remove them. That's certainly not a misrepresentation of the general consensus there.

The threads about people killing and driving into protestors got applauds.

So certainly very polarized.

>Generally, people are [sympathetic](https://globalnews.ca/news/8610727/ipsos-poll-trucker-convoy...) to the occupiers, but I wouldn't read too much into that--I'm in the large minority that have "sympathy" for them, but I want them gone as soon as possible.

People generally support what they represent. They look at the global trend of everyone dropping restrictions and they want the same. However, how many Canadians believe these protesters are also racists, sexists, and white supremacists? The smearing is going to have an effect.

>Indeed, rather than this being "way too far," for most Canadians, it's not far enough.

Yes, it seems very polar. Trudeau's in the tanks polls wise because the people who believe the smears think this is a military occupation that needs violence to solve.

>The occupation is in violation of several court injunctions, which makes it illegal.

Like what? That's the thing about peaceful assembly charter right. There's virtually no case law. Which means you can't really injunct against it. You can go after them for bylaw violations that dont involve people. You can ticket a car that is parked illegally. An illegally parked car is not something that makes it a military occupation or even for that matter illegal.

>As for peaceful? I'd disagree--there's been too many incidents of violence for me to characterize it that way, but frankly that's secondary when you're in systematic violation of court orders (without even considering all of the civil violations like parking, noise, public defecation, etc.)

That's the problem with fundamental human rights. I have a right to peacefully protest. Someone else showing up and being violent doesn't remove my right. That's what fuels counter protesters to be violent. City bylaws also have absolutely no bering here.

>Every single province had a pre-existing deconfinement plan. They've been accelerated as the hospital situation continues to improve.

Which will certainly appease many of the protesters to go home. Not all will go home. This legislation that Trudeau just engaged is specifically designed not to stop peaceful protesters. This means Trudeau has to pull the trigger on military eventually.

Misinformation is misinformation. I am certain I am misinformed about many things. The correct response to when I post misinformation is to inform.

What happened recently with the move to yellow journalism is not misinformation but rather censorship. Fact checkers end up labelling things in order to censor them.

The interesting thing on my mind in regards to Canada. Trudeau has changed. He would take on people head on at town halls and challenging questions: https://www.nbcnews.com/video/trudeau-takes-questions-about-...

Today he refuses to even consider talking to these ongoing protests and is going to insane extremes to shut these peaceful protests down. The only way to look at it from his point of view. He must see these people as national security threats. He genuinely believes they are racists and white supremacists. He genuinely believes they are there to overthrow the government.

Which there's no justification for other than egregiously being misinformed.

>This seems like a long time ago, but that last sentence is blatantly illegal in my country and I dare say a lot of states.

About 4 years ago. Here in Ontario, doing this is not considered illegal. Your employer is obligated to investigate harassment claims but not required to do anything at all. Including firing you. I know this because I went to 'office of the worker' whose lawyers told me this.

>On one hand, if the protests really were peaceful, I do not believe the government should shut them down.

Our charter right is peaceful assembly. If the protests were not peaceful, the police would be right to shut them down. The reason the Ottawa police cannot do anything for weeks is because they are peaceful.

>On the other hand, I’ve heard the protests have caused millions in trade to be shut down which I would not consider a peaceful act.

That would be an incorrect characterization. The bridge blockade did not touch the tunnel. https://www.post-gazette.com/news/nation/2022/02/12/Detroit-...

Furthermore, a blockade that isn't violent... isn't violence.

>If some non-citizen entity shut down millions in trade, I don’t think it would be viewed as peaceful.

Yes Trudeau has alleged that these blockades/occupations/sieges are in fact the US government. Even using the name occupation is a international definition. Military occupations would certainly justify the measures being taken by the Canadian governments.

I even agree, if the USA has a military occupation over Canada. Trudeau is right to do what he has done.

That's not what is happening. Trudeau is looking to squash peaceful political protests and the propaganda of calling the protesters racists and white supremacists is insane.

>Should the right to peaceful protest include the right to halt trade at this scale? Are the reports of halted trade overblown?

If the protests 'are at this scale' absolutely. Though yes, clearly the detroit tunnel was open. They even had 1 lane open for the bridge. It's completely overblown.

The correct action for the governments to do when protesters are blockading isn't to send in the guns and tear them down. It's to open conversation with the peaceful protesters. Liberal MP Joel Lightbound is a smart man. https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/liberal-mp-politicization-p...

the protesters just need a roadmap to no restrictions and human rights being returned.

Trudeau has taken this action because there is no roadmap. He wishes to keep the totalitarian state.

>Why are so many Americans obsessed about Canadian politics all of a sudden? The comments here are mostly non-Canadian, and are not representative of the current general sentiment in Canada.

Canadian here. Americans are concerned about Canadian democracy falling. 43 out of 50 states have no mandates; the remaining 7 are clear political lines. Many other countries in the world never had restrictions. Many who did have also dropped them. It's unreasonable for a high vaccinated country to remain so restricted. The smearing of these protests has been extreme to the point that the world is commenting how bad it is in Canada.

>While invocation of the Emergencies Act is always concerning, it's pretty clearly warranted here. There's always chance for abuse, but Trudeau's minority government is on thin ice and if they cross any lines they're as good as gone.

It's absolutely not warranted but also completely invalid. You cant use the act to shutdown peaceful protests. Several premiers who should have been consulted as per requirements of the act are publicly opposing this.

>I can only imagine the chaos that would unfold if this was happening in Washington, D.C., but it's not. I know some outraged Canadians who support the protests/blockades, but most of them are either extreme right wing (a comically small population compared to USA) or heavily biased through being directly impacted by restrictions (like the travel industry).

That's quite the characterization. Absolutely not accurate compared to my understanding.

>The vast majority of my friends, family, colleagues, strangers on the street, business owners I interact with, lawyers, CEOs, investors, healthcare workers, waiters, bartenders, bus drivers, teachers... are all in strong support of putting an end to the disruption, and in favour of vaccine passports, mask mandates, gathering restrictions, etc. to protect public health.

Of your friends.

https://twitter.com/AngusReid/status/1488044322192695297

In reality polls show somewhere between 50% and 75% of Canadians support the protests and think restrictions must end. you know... like the rest of the world is doing.

>Compared to the USA, Canadians care much more about what's best for the collective whole than about personal freedoms. This is simply a case of a small minority causing problems for the majority, amplified by the fact that the USA leans towards supporting the protestors.

You seem to be living in a political bubble. Out of curiosity, do you believe Trudeau when he says the protesters are 'fringe minority of racists, sexists, and white supremacists?'

>None of this is a surprise to anyone who has been watching. I could characterize it in a number of ways, but there is nobody left to persuade.

Not even a planck length of surprise to anyone.

>Given some obvious inevatabilities that flow downstream of this, what's the smart thing to do as an individual?

What a great question. Staying neutral? Join the protests on some side? At least try to understand what's happening?

>If you are aligned to the official narrative, the incentives are to double down to make sure nobody suspects you of disloyalty if it prevails.

I think when folks like Bill Maher call Trudeau out as sounding like Hitler... that was before he declared this last night. Even those on the left are seeing this as way too far. Something the convoy seems to have done is show how detached from reality Trudeau has become. He used to be a guy who would stand up in town halls and talk to anyone.

>f you are on the side of revolt, the official narrative is so increasingly divorced from reality as a means to signal it doesn't have to care about it - because this is how it says it is powerful - that it is impossible to sustain the dissonance to find any common ground or agreement in principle.

The mandates are falling around the world. Trudeau introduced new restrictions in January sparking this protest. It's clearly the wrong direction. The 'covid conspiracy theory' that this isn't about health. There hasnt been an emergency in quite some time. Trudeau's hand got laid down last night. This is no longer a conspiracy theory.

>I just don't see reconciliation as a result of this emergencies act process.

The Ottawa police have been unable to end the protests because they are legal peaceful protests. This emergencies act explicitly says you cant remove their internationally recognized human rights. Trudeau will find out shortly that the protesters are still not going anywhere, but worse force his hand. I will be quite surprised if the military doesnt get involved.

>My bets would be on a ratcheting up of controls over internet services, hyper aggressive financial services and tax enforcement, over the top surveillance exampples as threats, a miasma of staged and real "random" violence, escalating hit jobs and cancellations of the reasonable and principled, an official pivot to "fighting hate/terror" as a permanent emergency, etc.

No crystal ball needed to make these predictions. That's going to happen for sure.

>The only question to me is whether a new class of plausible leaders emerges to replace the terrible ones responsible for this nonsense, or decades of low level conflict with a radicalized populace vs. a state that has more international support than national legitimacy. The only out is removing internal passport controls and mandates. The alterative is clear. Such interesting times.

I have such respect for Liberal MP Joel Lightbound. A week ago he came out and said exactly this. Talk to the protesters, give them a reasonable roadmap to no restrictions. Stop the inflammatory attacks.

Nobody is saying you must drop the mandates tomorrow. But the reason Trudeau has gone this far is because there is no roadmap to no restrictions. Restrictions are staying. The protesters forced hishand and revealed this reality.