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Comment by cbhl | Hacker News Reader

> - It's OK to have the user agree that he's 13 years or older. Facebook cannot possibly check whether it's true, and the age doesn't matter anyway since the contract would be valid even if it weren't the case.

I suspect this clause is actually due to US law (COPPA).

Also, are kids allowed to agree to contracts in Germany? I believe that's not the case in the US.

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I didn't understand that part as well.

As far as I know, kids can't sign contracts. They are not "geschäftsfähig" (business capable) until they are 18. Unless the parents explicitly agree to some contract.

Kids under 7 cannot enter into contracts at all. Kids between 7 and 18 can enter into contracts, either if those contracts are entirely without duties to them (e.g. they can accept gifts) or if their contractual duties are somewhat negligible (e.g. they can buy sweets from their pocket money) or their guardians agreed to them being able to enter into such contracts. All other contracts are provisionally void (?!, "schwebend unwirksam"), i.e. can become void as soon as their guardians disagree with the contract or can become fully valid once their guardians agree.

> Kids between 7 and 18 can enter into contracts, either if those contracts are entirely without duties to them (e.g. they can accept gifts)

Huh, that's interesting. I'm not familiar with German law, but in the Netherlands this would legally be simply not a contract at all. A contract (in the Netherlands) explicitly requires (actually is defined as such) that both parties have contractual duties, and a contract is the formalisation of the exchange of these ("this for that").

It makes a lot of sense too. If one party has no duties, they can't be held to the contract, so what's the use of even having one.

I guess this is because in German law the central concept here is not the contract, but the Rechtsgeschäft, which is a broader term:

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rechtsgesch%C3%A4ft

Thanks for the link, I like to think I can read German reasonably well but you'll forgive me if that page is a bit much to digest right now ;-)

Teenagers can agree to contracts, but only in very limited terms. For example, they can buy food in a supermarket. Buying stuff in a store constitutes a contract.

Is that German law? Because in the Netherlands this is called a "sale", and comes with very different rights and duties for both parties.

When I said ’contract’ without qualifier then I meant any form of legally binding agreement including sale contracts. A contract does not need to be written down.

Under 18 you are not able to form fully valid contracts in Germany. Period.

If you're under 13 any contract that exceeds reasonable monthly allowance is automatically invalid.

All other contracts or "floating/pending valid", ie valid until the parents agree. There is also a clause on 16 to 18 year old kids but IIRC it just shifts responsibility away from the parents more. A contract that is "floating/pending valid" is usually not a problem, it just means the parents can terminate the contract as if it never existed within reasonable bounds (if you bought something from the supermarket and ate it, your parents won't be able to get the money back)

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