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Comment by wittjeff | Hacker News Reader

I've only used this a couple of times but I think it works: "I'd like to cancel my service. I'm going to say this really clearly for the recording, in case I have to subpoena this for evidence. I want to cancel my service, effective [date]. When I hang up this phone, I want there to be no financial relationship between myself and your company of any kind. None. I don't want any further communication from you other than a final statement showing a zero balance due. Now we can make this call as long as you'd like. No. Financial. Relationship. We're done." Then go silent, and if they try to pitch you any products of any kind, interrupt and ask "Are you refusing to cancel my service? Speak clearly for the recording."

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AM I BEING DETAINED?

But recording phone conversations is illegal in most states, so unless you live in a state where it's legal, they might know that you are bluffing.

Recording phone conversations secretly without the prior consent of all participants is illegal in many states. No state I am aware of disallows the recording of phone conversations entirely. For instance the law in my "two party consent" state, MA, defines the offense as

> 1. Interception, oral communications prohibited. Except as otherwise specifically provided in this section any person who? willfully commits an interception, attempts to commit an interception, or procures any other person to commit an interception or to attempt to commit an interception of any wire or oral communication shall be fined not more than ten thousand dollars, or imprisoned in the state prison for not more than five years, or imprisoned in a jail or house of correction for not more than two and one half years, or both so fined and given one such imprisonment.

and defines interception as

> 4. The term 'interception' means to secretly hear, secretly record, or aid another to secretly hear or secretly record the contents of any wire or oral communication through the use of any intercepting device by any person other than a person given prior authority by all parties to such communication;...

https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartIV/TitleI/Cha...

Usually the company is recording the call for "quality assurance purposes". They've already notified you of this and by staying on the call you consent to the recording. It is always legal to record if both parties consent.

It is my understanding that 38 of the states are one-party consent states. That is: in most states, it is perfectly legal to record your own phone calls. (It certainly is in my state; I'm taking Wikipedia's word for it for the other states) Though, to be fair, California (the state that TFA is about) is not one of those 38 states.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_recording_laws#Unite...

In some states only one party needs to know about the recording. In some state all parties need to know about it. If you tell them up front, they can refuse, but then it's just evidence that they're being difficult.

Certain keywords like "lawsuit" can break the strictly regimented conversation tree too.

Be a bit careful with the "l" word - many companies instruct their reps to immediately stop dealing with people that threaten legal proceedings over the phone and tell them to contact the company attorneys.

Remember that any company that doesn't empower the phone support people to help you probably didn't empower them enough to go off-script.

If I can contact the company attorneys via email, that would be preferred anyways.

Surely you don't want to speak to a company's attorney to cancel your gym membership, or to dispute a $5 purchase. I worked in retail, and people would threaten court over 10-20 euro purchases. We would immediately end the discussion, record their details and pass them on to our lawyers who would contact them within a few days, and presumably begin some arduous process.

If you had just been polite to me on the phone, I probably could have fixed your issue in 15 minutes.

They almost always record your calls for 'quality purposes'.

But you're not exactly right.. you can record phone conversations in the US provided you let them know before you push the 'record' button.

When they say, “this call may be recorded,” aren’t they giving you permission to record it?

Apparently not. This Daily Dot article quotes the EFF as saying that, even when a company informs you that your call is being recorded, you don't necessarily have the right to record it yourself:

"Dave Maass of the Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF) argues that what Davis did is likely illegal. 'Just because Comcast told the customer that the call was being recorded, that doesn’t mean it’s legal for him to record the call without notification,' Maass tells the Daily Dot. 'To stay on the right side of the law, everyone has to let everyone else know if they’re recording a conversation.'"

Source- https://www.dailydot.com/layer8/comcast-customer-service-rec...

I've never thought about it that way, but yes, it does seem like they are giving you permission. Thanks for the new insight!

Isn't it legal in every state so long as you disclose that the call is being recorded?

No. Many states require “two party consent” to record a phone conversation. Notice is not equivalent to consent. Companies do this all the time because none have their eyes sued out for it. Yet. In my experience if you protest the recording they will stop and have two people do the call with you.

Almost every single call center I've ever called has that, "This call may be monitored for quality assurance." disclaimer.

But does that also mean "You may record this call"? Because it doesn't say by who it is monitored.

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