Hacker News Reader

Comment by some_account | Hacker News Reader

50 year old programmer in the middle of an open office with 25 year olds bouncing balls around, playing loud music - bad culture fit.

Foreign middle aged man who can't speak the language very good in an environment where native language is important - not a good culture fit.

Female 25 year old in a group of 50 year old men who mostly wants to relax at work and are a bit awkward around young women - bad culture fit.

Very outspoken social person who enjoys partying in the middle of senior bank personalities who are extremely detail oriented and introverted - bad culture fit.

Just saying there is a lot of bad culture fits. It can be age, gender, race, personality and even appearance. Bad culture fit is everywhere. It's just not something we talk about very openly because it's not socially accepted. So we hide it under other reasons.

View on HN

I think you're right that this happens in all the scenarios you mention.

But I'm certain the first and third example you've given aren't just "not socially accepted," they're actually illegal in the United States and many other places. The second one is questionable but may also be illegal, depending on whether the issue is actually English competency or just "he's foreign."

Only the fourth one, which is based on the person's behavior but not their membership in a protected class, is anything like what "culture fit" can or should legally be used for.

I agree with you that this kind of discrimination-by-another-name is status quo, but are you okay with it? If no, what do we do about it? If yes... why should I be?

> t's just not something we talk about very openly because it's not socially accepted.

It's not openly talked about because it's illegal. The next time a 50yo applies inform him that you're looking for someone under 40 and if you're lucky he'll hire a nice lawyer to explain it to you.

50 year old programmer in the middle of an open office with 25 year olds bouncing balls around, playing loud music - bad culture fit.

Really? I'm almost 50 and I'm in an office with a bunch of 20-somethings who like to yo-yo. Music is only on headphones, though.

Female 25 year old in a group of 50 year old men who mostly wants to relax at work and are a bit awkward around young women - bad culture fit.

That's very dependent on the particular people involved. I've been in plenty of contexts where 40 and 50-something men could relax with a 25 year old woman. (Traditional music.) In times past, such a circumstance was pretty normal. People have ways of creating temporary spaces, both exclusive and inclusive. Letting this happen in ways that are positive is how larger gatherings and groups of people are supposed to work. It's where we've mucked about with that, albeit sometimes with the best intentions, where dysfunctions have crept in.

Shouldn't then the job descriptions just mention that so it's obvious for the applicant beforehand?

That's actually a good point. If job discriptions had a short description of the team / company culture, it would weed out many non fitting candidates.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com