Comment by watwut | Hacker News Reader

Comment by watwut | Hacker News Reader

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The article makes many strong but dubious claims. Like, I am inclined to believe that many teens and kids could handle more responsibility, but a lot written in article just does not sound trustworthy. (The part where I disagree is the part where author promotes early marriage, I dont think it is good idea to marry as teen.)

Like:

> American teens are subjected to more than 10 times as many restrictions as mainstream adults, twice as many restrictions as active-duty U.S. Marines, and even twice as many as incarcerated felons.

> It's hard to keep a marriage together when there is constant conflict with teens.

Are conflicts with teens really cause of that many divorces?

> The factory system doesn't work in the modern world, because two years after graduation, whatever you learned is out of date.

That is highly exaggerated statement. I am pretty sure 2 years after you are just find.

> Unfortunately, most people learn in those classrooms to hate education for the rest of their lives.

Is this actually true that over 50% of people hate school in America?

> young people are integrated into adult society as soon as they are capable, and there is no sign of teen turmoil

Is this result of actual study of teens in those societies? Or just reflection of assumptions? Because from what I read about history, in European societies where young people worked in the past, young people were still quick to join revolutionary movements or just get drunk and fight it out in streets. Plus, they often lived and work with families for economic reasons.

> Teens in America are in touch with their peers on average 65 hours a week, compared to about four hours a week in preindustrial cultures.

Were they really "in touch" with siblings and cousins only for 4 hours a week?

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Plus, the reason teens are not considered adults is not that their IQ would be low. The reason is impulsivity and similar considerations.

> Plus, the reason teens are not considered adults is not that their IQ would be low. The reason is impulsivity and similar considerations.

Maybe what we call "impulsivity" is just an healthy reaction against absurd constraints and monotony? We forget very easily that we are animals, and the way we have been living for the last few centuries is radically different from the way we were evolved to live.

Perhaps factory-like schooling is inherently painful, and what we call "adulthood" is just learned helplessness...

1.) My life was way less monotonous when I was a teenager. The most monotonous period started when I had children. You dont get more monotonous then that currently. In school, at least you learn about something different every day and can do different things during breaks or read or play games.

2.) Before factory like schooling, I guess we mean feudalism and traditional farm households, teenagers were not free at all by any meaningful definition of that word. No one was.

3.) How far exactly in history do you want to go? Because you really have to go so far that we dont really know how people lived. But, it might involve getting pregnant at 14 by a strong dude who decides restrictions placed on you due to being stronger.

Medieval peasants (and serfs) had a lot of freedom with how to spend their day to day. They had chores, and several weeks a year of grueling sun up to sun down labor. But it's not usually harvest season or planting season, and they had nearly half the year off. Working hours increased dramatically during the industrial revolution.

Winter was not off. You still have to care about animals and you still have to care about tools and you still have to cook and care about toddlers and babies.

You still need to sew cloth, create shoes, create candles, feather-bed and what not.

People in traditional societies are also impulsive in that age. Besides, other mammals have the same transient period as well, from the domesticated (dogs) to the wild ones. It'not just modern human society.

n=1, but sure:

* Teenage life is a constant struggle against rules laid down by adults. They have money, legal power, and cultural experience. To be fair, teens are brats.

* Between me and my three siblings, only one of us did not cause the parents to consider divorce. Two siblings did cause divorces.

* The factory system really doesn't work. I recall ranting in debate class about how there isn't a single industry whose entry-level workflows are taught in school and yet high-schoolers are expected to be qualified to enter the workforce after graduation.

* 50% sounds quite low. Almost everybody hated school. In order to not hate school, one would have to be liked by teachers, high-performing both academically and in clubs, not mind hours of studying and cramming, and be at the top of the social hierarchy. I can think of maybe two people from my graduating class who definitely did not hate school, one of whom was valedictorian.

* Social networks are essential. Even as the weird geeky kid, people still constantly sent me instant messages and chats. Cell phones weren't yet common; I can only imagine that teens are even more gregarious now.

And sure, kids shouldn't marry young. I only saw one pair of teens doing that in my graduating class, but it does happen occasionally.

> And sure, kids shouldn't marry young. I only saw one pair of teens doing that in my graduating class, but it does happen occasionally.

The article author advocates for early marriage. I am not saying that it is good idea nor how often it happened. I am reacting to article author claiming it would be a good idea to marry them teenagers.

Oh! Then no, of course not. Marriage is only useful as an instrument of coercion and control; nobody should feel like they ought to get married.

Not that long ago teens went to work at 16 or younger, my mum worked at Cable and Wireless as a telex operator.

And the generation before that often started work at 14, I recall chatting with a retired guy who had started work at the GPO as a telegram messenger boy at 14

And in more rural areas of the US they would have worked on the farm from a young age.

I'm struggling to think of any knowledge or skill which has become obsolete in the last two years. Has the last Cobol program been ported at last?

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