Comment by clouddrover | Hacker News Reader

Comment by clouddrover | Hacker News Reader

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> German car manufacturers deserve everything coming to them

What's coming to Volkswagen is that they'll be the world's biggest producer of EVs. It's not that surprising. After all, they are the world's biggest car company.

2020 is the start of Volkswagen's big EV push. This is what Volkswagen's 2020 EV plan looks like:

- VW e-Up!: https://www.carscoops.com/2019/09/vws-updated-e-up-offers-16...

- VW e-Golf (sold over 100,000 but will be replaced by the ID.3): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ah4lrqWx8E0

- VW ID.3: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IPjvgXWA78E

- VW ID.4: https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/motor-shows-frankfurt-mot...

- SEAT Mii: https://www.electrive.com/2019/09/11/seat-mii-available-to-o...

- SEAT el-Born: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZI7WFtwc8g

- Cupra Tavascan (maybe, not confirmed): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNYHRKp4n1w

- Skoda Citigo iV: https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/new-skoda-citigo...

- Skoda Vision iV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-f1g9xl6W_E

- Audi e-tron (and also the new "sportback" variant): https://www.audiusa.com/models/audi-e-tron

- Audi e-tron Q4: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiwevzHsCbU

- Audi e-tron GT (maybe 2021): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMEdiq2xTbQ

- Porsche Taycan (and the Sports Turismo wagon variant in future): https://www.porsche.com/usa/models/taycan/

More models in 2021 and more in 2022 and so on.

The Volkswagen ID.3 will be a big seller in Europe and then later on in China. It's a popular form factor with good range at a good price.

Taycan and e-tron are both huge flops so far and the ID.3 is off to a bad start as there are reports that they are having massive problems with the cars software and are literally building the cars and plan to store them in a lot for a year while they sort out the software issues.

https://electrek.co/2019/12/19/volkswagen-id3-has-massive-so...

Is it? Then why is the Audi e-tron outselling the Tesla Model X in Europe:

https://ev-sales.blogspot.com/2019/12/europe-november-2019.h...

Spec wise etron competes against Model 3 and up coming Model Y not Model X. Large cars and SUVs like S and X don’t have a big market in Europe

No, that's just making excuses. The Audi e-tron is in no way aimed at the same segment as the Model 3.

The Audi e-tron and the Jaguar I-Pace both outsell the Model X and the Model S in Europe. The e-tron and the I-Pace are doing well for what they are: expensive luxury vehicles.

Model S and X sales were substantially higher then etron is now before the the Model 3 was introduced.

> there are reports that they are having massive problems with the cars software and are literally building the cars and plan to store them in a lot for a year while they sort out the software issues

The plan to pre-build several parking lots full of cars before starting to sell predates the issues they face with the software. It was probably made with "let's catch any issues before delivery" in mind (which now paid off), but it's also because VW isn't a company that creates hype through limited availability and pre-orders: once the model is brought to market, you're supposed to be able to go the store and get a car in a few days or weeks.

Given that their previous models were quite software-heavy already, it's not as if this is the first time they have to bring software onto devices. I have no idea how often similar issues happened in previous roll-outs, but this is certainly the most closely watched VW model ramp-up in decades because of the novelty of them going all-in on EV.

The Taycan seems a huge success. The reviews are extremely positive (many pointing how much better it's put together than the Teslas) and production has been doubled to cope with the high amount of reservations

https://techcrunch.com/2019/07/29/porsche-taycan-reservation...

That article was written before two key events that have probably taken a lot of the shine off. First Tesla's Model S Plaid edition was announced and seen racing around the Nurburgring. Second the official EPA range rating was released and it came in a third less than expected. Those reservation holders who's commitment so far is only a ~$3k refundable deposit are going to have second thoughts.

[0] https://www.engadget.com/2019/12/11/taycan-turbo-epa-estimat...

[1] https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-model-s-plaid-nurburgring-ne...

> First Tesla's Model S Plaid edition was announced and seen racing around the Nurburgring.

Hrm, does the Model S Plaid come with a free tow truck or is that an optional extra: https://www.thedrive.com/news/29946/porsche-taycan-laps-brok...

> Those reservation holders who's commitment so far is only a ~$3k refundable deposit are going to have second thoughts.

Are they? Let's see what actual Taycan owners think about it so far: https://electrek.co/2019/12/21/first-us-porsche-taycan-owner...

And let's see what the performance is like compared to a Model S:

https://www.thedrive.com/news/30467/watch-a-porsche-taycan-t...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uum9nffLasQ

But don't worry about it. There's a number of EVs which outperform Teslas.

I think you overestimate the importance of the EPA rating for a worldwide vehicle (Europeans really don't care about the EPA for ex). The reviews are overwhelmingly positive and full of superlatives - this is the true "high end electric car" to beat now. Yes Tesla might tweak the Model S to make it a bit faster, and it's significantly cheaper, but it also feels significantly cheaper to sit in and drive, and it's unlikely to magically improve tomorrow because Porsche has had decades of refining those qualities.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vq6KEOIiMg

The EPA rating of electric vehicle range more accurately represents highway driving range than the WLTP rating which is geared toward stop and go city driving. Hence if you are doing long distance trips on the highway the EPA rating will more accurately represent your real life experience. For those used to gas mileage being worse in cities and better on highways with gas cars electric cars are largely opposite. Lower speeds use less energy in general.

[0] https://insideevs.com/news/365941/what-car-different-results...

by end of 2021 they only expect 330k total BEV vehicles globally.. that is not a big push from a company making over ten million cars per year. now they expect to reach a million per year by 2023 but that still keeps their percentage very low.

the simple truth is, no they aren't trying very hard. they have to cater both to politicians and unions at home neither of which can sustain the job losses BEVs will lead too; not just in the manufacturing but it cascades into after market, petrol refining, gas stations, and more.

It's just a multi-year initiative. Takes a bit time to develop the cars, have the factories for them and bring the cars to market.

If you follow Volkswagen news, you can see that they are steady making progress and and have a very large initiative.

"VW e-Up!"

Oh dear, that name doesn't translate well into British English. Sounds like it's made in Yorkshire..

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