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Comment by sequoia | Hacker News Reader

"For example, over 70% of early Beta-testers say that the VPN helps them feel empowered, safe, and independent while being online."

What have these "feelings" got to do with anything? This is a measure of successful marketing and has nothing to do with the product or its efficacy.

Personally I use Windscribe and I really like it (I've used PIA & Mullvad in the past). I use it for watching US Netflix and to make it slightly less easy to track me on the net (I know there are many other ways). I also like the idea of not having my IP or the gov't spy on me _as easily_.

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=== edit because I feel this comment is not substantive enough / engages with a strawman version of your comment ===

I understand you're talking about where those feelings come from -- ie, that the feelings are more useful information when backed by the reason for them. And you do provide some of that in your post (privacy, watching US Netflix). But those are things that any trustworthy VPN with US-based endpoints can provide, so they're not a unique selling point, which means your recommendation basically boils down to unsubstantiated feelings again, to which:

=== Original comment ===

I don't use a VPN and have no horse in this race, but surely you see the irony in:

> What have these "feelings" got to do with anything?

Followed by

> I use Windscribe and I really like it.

"unsubstantiated feelings" heh, that's a pretty ungenerous/rude way of putting it. Here's a better way: "Can you explain why you like Windscribe? You say you've used other providers, how is Windscribe different?" If you're not clear on something it's always best to ask for clarification before accusing the other party of fabrication or making "unsubstantiated" claims.

So why do I like Windscribe? Good question! I like the ease of use of windscribe clients compared to other VPN clients I've used, the fact that I can add many devices, and the fact that it has endpoints in lots of countries. I had trouble with both the PIA & Mullvad clients & configuration on my desktop and phone eventually. I don't require much, as you say VPN is a commodity product, I just want it to be easy to use & Windscribe is and they seem committed to adding features & fixing bugs. I also have met the team, they're local to me, and they seem trustworthy.

I'm not sure if you read TFA, but here's the context of what I highlighted:

> We started working with a small group of you and learned a lot. With the VPN in your hands, we confirmed some of our initial hypotheses and identified important priorities for the future. For example, over 70% of early Beta-testers say that the VPN helps them feel empowered, safe, and independent while being online.

"we confirmed some of our initial hypotheses and identified important priorities for the future ... Beta-testers say that the VPN helps them feel empowered, safe, and independent"

What type of initial hypotheses might have been confirmed by learning that people "feel empowered" by using a VPN? This is what I don't understand. Of course users motivated enough to try a beta VPN product like using VPNs–I'm not sure what insight that adds. Can you help me connect the dots here?

My feelings about a VPN provider based on personal experience is not beta testing that "proves" a product. Mozilla suggests here that these "feelings" prove "confirm their hypothesis" and put numbers next to the feelings, like 70%. I am questioning the relevancy of these numbers & it strikes me as pseudo-scientific to put these numbers in the intro as some sort of proof that their product has value. Throwing up meaningless numbers like this gives me the impression of smoke and mirrors/bullshit.

> "unsubstantiated feelings" heh, that's a pretty ungenerous/rude way of putting it.

Thank you for the feedback. It wasn't meant to be rude, but I see now how it can be interpreted that way (particularly with the unedited original comment below, which was intended to be... not rude, but let's say, harsher than I'm proud of, a few hours later). Text is hard -.-

Asking clarifying questions instead is a good suggestion. Your answers are good, too; if I'm ever in the vpn market, I'll put Windscribe on my shortlist to research more thoroughly.

> I'm not sure if you read TFA

I have not and do not currently intend to. I checked in with the comments because I was curious how it would be received. I replied to your comment because I was frustrated at what seemed to be hypocritical criticism. I still think your original comment is light on detail/justificatipn, so I'm happy my reply, however rude and imperfect, lead to your second comment, which is the type of thing I was hoping to find when I opened the thread :)

I think "feeling" safe is an important component of a product. Of course the product has to also be effective, but if it's effective and people still don't trust it, then they won't use it. A good example of a similar situation is in the US military where we had to do yearly chemical weapons training that involved putting on a gas mask in a room filled with tear gas. The gas masks were already proven to work, but one purpose of the training was to make sure people trusted their equipment to keep them safe, making it more likely for them to use it when needed.

I would counter that how safe people feel, and to what extent they have an expectation of privacy online will determine their behavior. The technical effectiveness of the product is one thing, but how users perceive it will determine whether it offers them any real benefit. These things do matter.

Remember Foucault's panopticon: If someone merely thinks they might be surveilled their behavior will change in profound ways. More concretely, if you think the government may be spying on your browsing habits, maybe there are sites you won't visit or comments you won't post or videos you won't watch. It's important not only that the product works, but that people feel it works so that they can behave more freely on the internet.

This is marketing copy. Criticizing it for being marketing copy is surely a little redundant. Besides, feelings matter. If the majority of VPN users felt that the security provided by the VPN was not worth the effort involved in using then that would indicate a failed product. Ignore that at your peril.

People buy on emotions

What was the 500 startup guys phrase?

A product has to get you “Made, Paid or Laid“

Where Made was like a sense of positive promotion like a made-man in the mob I think.

Emotion is everything. If a product doesn’t make you feel good you’ll only buy it because you have to.

... and sell!

It sounds like a sanitary pad ad.

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