Comment by zzzeek | Hacker News Reader

Comment by zzzeek | Hacker News Reader

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Without Hacker News I would never even know that such insane authors exist:

"This expectation underestimates the human desire to feel strong, the powerful psychological appeal for many, not just in Britain, in taking pride in the conquests of their ancestors. It offers a sense of collective strength they can tap into as individuals. If they, of whom I am one, could be so triumphant in the past, surely I too possess triumph in me?

The morality of taking pride in ancestral conquests involving the killing and subjugation of other human beings is questionable, but its psychological appeal is undeniable."

why yes, it sure is a RUSH to conquer other people and take all their stuff, especially for the huge number of masses that never had to actually, you know, kill anyone, they just get to have all this awesome land and stuff and kind of a curious way that all the streets seem to be named after native americans even though I've never met any here at all, shrugs.... conquest is awesome! teach the controversy, people!

It's disappointing to me to see such a knee-jerk misinterpretation of an apparently sincere article. The author merely pointed out an almost obvious aspect of human nature, and you attack him as though he holds this belief.

My father was actually colonized. He actually went to Nigeria, expecting to find a unified black Africa just waiting to throw off the shackles of colonialism. As the civil war erupted he actually watched tribalism consume the country and saw Igbos having their heads caved in with crankshafts wielded by other black Africans.

He would understand the nuance and ultimately truth of the author's argument.

It's weird and sad to see people in North America who have never been colonized, who have never picked up a weapon just completely lose their minds about stuff that doesn't bother the actual people who were actually colonized. Stop being outraged on others' behalf and talk to those with experience, or listen to people like this author. There's a lot you're missing.

the US is a colonized nation. The relatively low population (because up to 95% were killed) of Native Americans in this country live with profound social problems and in horrid conditions (there's Native American reservations right here I have seen) and they are not happy about it. I'm outraged on their behalf. As kids we grew up playing things like "cowboys and indians" and naming our sports teams things like "the redskins". We as kids were fully ignorant of what any of this meant decades ago. Once we learned, if you decided to feel "pride" that we wiped out a whole culture, or revulsion, basically says a lot about what kind of person you probably are.

Sure, obviously. We seem to be straying a long way from this article about Nigeria written by a Nigerian. Maybe we should listen to and value the Nigerian's perspective about Nigeria instead of zooming in on an uncharitable interpretation of one sentence from his article, is all I'm saying.

A friend's mother was put into a residential school in Canada. When she says "it wasn't all bad" is that a defense of the practice and institution? Of course not, but maybe we should listen to her, you know, lived experience and add it to all the other experiences.

EDIT> Think of it this way: why are you telling a Nigerian how to Nigeria, in the spirit of anti-oppression?

EDIT2> People and life are complicated. We live in a world where people beat the crap out of each other based on which sport ball jersey their team wears. Nuance and anti-knee-jerk are required if we're going to find our way out of this chimpanmess.

You confuse the author's identification of this impulse with his holding that view.

He identifies one reason why a large chunk of people might feel pride for their ancestors' subjugation of others. Should he not shine a light on it?

OP likes to feel the rush of shooting the messenger.

certainly not a favorable light! the lack of ethics in this community is just depressing to me

I think he was being charitable. Not wanting to offend anyone. He ended like this

So for British teachers wondering how to teach the subject, it is important to cite various perspectives, including, crucially, the perspectives of the colonised; not in a wholly arbitrary manner seeking to buttress this or that grand narrative, but in a way revealing the complexities and contradictions of Britain’s colonial encounter with Africa.

which suggests he doesn't agree with their views. I think he is pretty neutral.

> Not wanting to offend anyone.

he failed! suggesting the psychological appeal of knowing that I grew up in a town that was violently ripped from native americans makes me feel AWFUL, what kind of psychotic asshole do you need to be to actually know about the genocide you live on top of and then to feel pride in that? People are generally not bothered by their own colonialist history because they're shockingly ignorant of what it actually means to go somewhere and eradicate an entire culture. But to suggest that these people are actually intimitely aware of such conquest and that it there is "undeniable appeal" to feeling "proud" of that is revolting.

But I don't think he's suggesting he's reporting his experience with Britons. I'm pretty sure they evade the bad parts of empire in their education. Just like the Civil Rights Movement is sanitized in US.

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