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Comment by voisin | Hacker News Reader

> but up against a company that's been making really good stuff for 40+ years, I'm skeptical.

IPhone was up against some groups with decades of making phones. Tesla is up against companies with literally a century of experience. SpaceX is up against companies that have made rockets for decades. Etc etc etc. I am surprised anyone on HN would be skeptical that a company with billions of dollars of cash at its disposal and world class engineering talent could do a passable job here all because an incumbent has experience. Also, are you suggesting that experience of one set of engineers with mastery of obsolete technologies 40 years ago is somehow a gate that a current company needs to pass through and excel at before they can compete with that company’s current engineers on current technology?

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Most of those examples are not great. Tesla isn't making cars... they're making electric cars.

The iPhone wasn't the first phone, or even mobile phone. It was the first mass market SmartPhone.

Those products each have a differentiator. "Cool Wireless Headphones" isn't something new or novel.

> "Cool Wireless Headphones" isn't something new or novel.

That might well be, but the original AirPods were the first bluetooth headset I got that Actually Worked. BT earbuds quality was shockingly low before. It might well have been the classic Apple Timing phenomenon, when they release a product at the exact right time a technology is mature enough to work (e.g. large modern touchscreens etc), but they undeniably scored with what where, otherwise, pretty mediocre earbuds. They generally know what they are doing.

This said, $500+ for earbuds of any kind is too much, for my values, particularly this year when people and countries are literally starving. It's bad taste.

Hrmn. There are an awful lot of luxury products out there. When folks are driving around on $50k+ cars, I’m not sure what’s wrong with $500+ headphones. (Not that I’m about to buy either.)

Well, the reason AirPods are great is the same reason why an M1 outclasses all intel competitors: they are optimized for a platform that is developed by one company.

It's pretty curious then that Airpod Max aren't: that movie watching experience is quite perplexing.

I don't even want to imagine what people will get with non-Apple audio sources.

All of the examples. SpaceX is up against companies that made single-use rockets for decades.

But the AirPods Max may have a technical differentiator (not even just an Apple logo!) — AFAIK they’re the first wireless headphones without an on/off switch! (perhaps some of the earlier ones that don’t work once Apple stops replacing the batteries, as well?)

The first mass market smartphone was probably like.. the Nokia 3650? :P

The iPhone was the first capacitive touch, finger friendly UI phone. The first OS release wasn't even that "smart" in that native apps could only be installed with a jailbreak.

> first mass market SmartPhone.

Remember Blackberry?

> are you suggesting that experience of one set of engineers with mastery of obsolete technologies 40 years ago is somehow a gate that a current company needs to pass through and excel at before they can compete

Yes. Not a gate, but a bar they need to clear. Audio is not easy, and I disagree that most of the skills in question are obsolete. The electronics, sure. But the NC algorithms and driver are old yet still unsolved fields.

Of course, as you say, billions of dollars and poaching those employees will help them do it in less time.

> Tesla is up against companies with literally a century of experience.

And Tesla sucks at stuff that years of experience helps you get right. Like doors that close evenly, and windows seals that don't leak. The simple, little things.

Ohyes is clearly trying to differentiate between innovation products and evolutionary ones, so the comparisons with innovative companies isn’t apt.

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