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Comment by GordonS | Hacker News Reader

> Wouldn't it be a more appropriate comparison to look at someone with an "average" pension

We're discussing salary of software engineers, firstly because this is HN, and secondly because software engineer salaries in the US are an outlier. Also as I mentioned in my original comment, the figures I gave don't include our pensions at all (as an aside, 55 is the earliest you can currently take anything from private penions in the UK), so I think the comparison is valid enough.

If my wife also had a job as a salaried software engineer, instead of working on our business, our combined income would likely be around €105k, which is still more than enough to be able to live very well and save a lot of money at the same time, as long as you are financially savvy.

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Yes but your plans to retire at 50 are certainly taking your pension into account, no? Or could someone survive in Scotland on $500k? I'm not sure what the investment landscape is there but in the US $500k will only get you about $20k/yr on conservative withdrawal schedules.

Yes, the plan is to use that cash until we take pensions from 55 (or probably later if the gov moves the age forward); I meant the pensions weren't included in the €500k I quoted, which is a mix of cash, stocks, bonds and P2P lending.

I'm pushing 40, so there's another 10 years to build up the cash/stocks/bonds/lending pot further, and another 15 to build up the pensions further (well, hopefully of course). Might even choose to retire before 50, since I'll have enough that I'll have the option of trading off yearly withdrawals vs working longer.

I think my point still stands: software engineers in Europe earn less than those in SV (and it's important to remember than SV is an outlier even on the US), but you can still live a very comfortable life, save a lot, and retire early (even if not quite as early as 50), all while working far fewer hours and living in a society that provides free healthcare, education (including higher education in Scotland) and unemployment safety nets, and where society looks out for everyone, not just "number 1".

Edit: forgot to also say that the company pension has not always been as great it is now, and to also mention that 2/3 of our pension pot is actually in person pensions (SIPPs).

First, the issue is that you'd need to compare free healthcare in "Europe" (it varies quite a bit both in how free to how good, but ok), to what you can get on a $500k salary in the US. You don't compare the situation described, but something different.

Second, most developers don't run an independent ISV with their spouse ... If you did this in the US you'd have to further compare: $200k in .eu with healthcare with, say, $500k plus double that in business income, or $1.5m per year.

I think healthcare is going to be FAR better for you in the US. This won't be true for everyone, maybe won't even be true for most, but for you there can be little doubt.

I don't understand your 2nd paragraph - the business wouldn't magically make more money if it was based in the US (we sell globally, including the US).

Healthcare here in the UK is totally free. I know only too well (to my detriment) that it's far from perfect, but I still believe it's a wonderful thing for all of society. Plus nobody needs to worry about whether they can afford to call an ambulance, and nobody is going to be bankrupted if they have a hospital stay.

I wouldn't say healthcare in the UK is free, but rather it has a good balance.

If you have an accident or chronic illness, the system won't leave you alone. But they cover zero cost of prevention. E.g. regular check-ups, blood tests, therapies, unless you have noticeable symptoms are not covered, which is often too late to catch cancer, diabetes or cardiological illness at an early stage. My wife and I spend between £2000-3000 a year on these in various countries (to make it affordable). This number is not terrible, but far from free.

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