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Comment by orblivion | Hacker News Reader

A Japanese acquaintance once told me that an office he worked at once instituted a strict "go home at the end of the day" policy to prevent people from staying late. I guess there's a sort of cultural pressure not to be the first one out of the office (which I can actually sort of understand; I feel weird leaving early).

Apparently it worked out really well. Either similar or improved output. However after a management changeover things went back to as before. It's a cultural hurdle, sounds like.

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When we overwork, the line between work and personal time blurs such that they eventually become the same. So you don't feel guilty about slacking off.

Long hours in an office setting promote procrastination. Why do something now when you are going to be here at 8PM anyway and will need something to occupy your time?

Once you stop procrastinating, because you know you can't be at work late, then you build up work inertia. This is probably where all the efficiency gains are.

That's a great point. This explains why I have not been able to get anything done after lunch during this extended WFH situation. I used to think it was because I ate too much or something similar, but this had never been the case when I was in office. Now I need to figure out how to trick my mind to believe that I can't login after 5pm :(

> Now I need to figure out how to trick my mind to believe that I can't login after 5pm :(

That seems easy, set an alarm on 4.30 or 4.45 as a warning, then add a scheduler / cron job to shutdown at 5.

However from my experience, I tend to slack if my tasks aren't urgent, and only productive for 4 hours a day (2 before lunch and 2 after).

IMO it's fine since it feels more like marathon than sprints. If I want to be more productive, I need to raise each tasks's sense of urgency.

Yup. I am always more productive when I force myself to log off at 5pm.

In Japan, staying long hours at work is not about productivity, as I explained in my other comment. It's to make sure to understand that now, your office, your peers = your life. That's for the exact same reason you invite co-workers and your boss to make a speech at your wedding once you get married: your work is your new family (whether you like it not).

The sheer number of times I've left a frustrating problem at work for the day, and come back in the next day and solved it in 5 minutes, makes me believe this would be the case.

Beyond a certain point you really aren't achieving anything.

That pressure is alive and well at places I've worked (USA). I used to finish my work day at 3pm, and I always made sure to leave at exactly 3pm. I would often get sideways looks and jealous vibes from my coworkers, even though everyone knew I was done at 3. No one ever really paid attention to the fact I was showing up to work at least a couple of hours before them, and the feeling that I was "cheating" by leaving early never really went away. The pressure was there all the time to stay longer, and honestly it really irritated me. We were given core hours to be in the office but because others made the choice to come in later I was left feeling like I did something "bad" due to comments and other implied communication.

These days I run my own place, but the pressure to work longer hours is due to so much needing to get done that can't be completed in 8 hour days. Self-inflicted pressure is way worse because I can't get up and leave it behind.

One place I worked at actually gave us a 15 minute warning to get out at 5. That start-up meant it too, they kicked you out, and you'd need permission from the CEO to stay (his policy). You could take your laptop home if you were desperate, but you couldn't stay there.

>I guess there's a sort of cultural pressure not to be the first one out of the office (which I can actually sort of understand; I feel weird leaving early).

AFAIK, the big cultural pressure in Japan is specifically leaving before your boss does.

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