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Comment by sharkweek | Hacker News Reader

I spent some time in Central America radicalizi... err I mean traveling for fun, after college.

One of the things that always stood out to me was how patient everyone generally was with one another.

I remember riding around on chicken buses to get from town to town, and on more than one occasion, the bus would just pull over and the driver would get out, grab some lunch, talk to a friend. Nobody was in a rush.

My friend that I was traveling with and I would stare at each other and be like "what the hell is going on?" as we looked around at everyone else on the bus and nobody seems to care at all that their day has this arbitrary delay. I can only imagine if a driver did that here in Seattle with 30+ people all trying to get somewhere.

I like living in the US, I think it has some massive upsides, but I also think I'm a bit of a hostage to what I think my life is supposed to look like, versus simplification somewhere else.

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> My friend that I was traveling with and I would stare at each other and be like "what the hell is going on?" as we looked around at everyone else on the bus and nobody seems to care at all that their day has this arbitrary delay. I can only imagine if a driver did that here in Seattle with 30+ people all trying to get somewhere.

This does happen on Seattle-area transit, but definitely not on every route. Routes on the south end, both of Seattle and in south King County, are far more likely to have a couple of drivers who will pass each other and briefly pop open the door or slide open the window for a minute of chat. I've seen drivers taking their layover or lunch at Burien TC or TIBS who gab like old friends with any other drivers they encounter. But at Northgate or Aurora Village? Almost never happens.

Back before the big restructure in advance of Capitol Hill and UW stations opening, I rode the 72 virtually every day. If I got a particular driver, I mentally built in a roughly 6-minute wait somewhere in Ravenna because he'd pass a friend out walking or also driving a bus and they'd chat. Same for the 4 through the Central District with a different driver.

I like that transit has improved so much around here that it's easier and faster to get almost everywhere I'm going. But I also remember the quirks of transit past with that fondness of memory.

Can you imagine coming to a client meeting 30 minutes late and telling him that the bus driver decided on a whim stop halfway through the route to chat up an old friend?

I mean, sure? How's that different from being 30 minutes late because someone dumped a load of frozen fish on the highway?

This mad rush to be everywhere at a specific time, usually when tens of thousands of other people are also trying to be at a similar spot at the same time, is a major cause of people being traffic. Heck, as the pandemic has shown, we don't even really need to always be in the same physical place to have a meeting; technology can relieve us of that burden.

My family gave up driving years ago, due to cost and stress, and it's been great largely for this reason. I don't worry about dealing with all of the people who have Very Important Places To Be. That's Metro's job, and they do it well.

It's all perspective. If there is an accident then that's kind of unavoidable. The bus driver however is just stealing half an hour from the dozen or more people under his care on a whim.

Right, but from the perspective of the bus rider, it's still unavoidable, as the rider can't control the bus driver. So I'd say it's still an acceptable excuse to give at the client meeting, unless there are other, more timely methods of transportation that you could reasonably be expected to take.

In places where this is sort of thing is common, I wonder if people aren't bothered by it because they truly in their heart of hearts don't mind, or because they've just resigned themselves to the unpredictability of their transportation.

This reminds me (fondly) of the Caribbean.

GP commenters is missing out that this is usually a culture-wide expectation.

If you're 30 minutes late, you mention the bus, and your boss gives you a knowing smile. Because it happens to him too.

Efficient? Less so. More relaxed? God yes.

Exactly, the work ethic is definitely different in South America (grew up there)

> Can you imagine

That's kinda the point. If it's culturally acceptable for this to be normal behavior, then yes, people _would_ accommodate such disruptions.

It is hard to imagine anything ever getting anything big done with this kind of attitude. If you have a project were one part being late holds up the rest of the project--which is most of them--an attitude like this is almost impossible to work with. It is ultimately a rather selfish lifestyle.

I mean...it's not really though. There are plenty of countries that don't have the rush/stress/demands of the US (aka what you're referring to as "this attitude") that are getting plenty "done".

> attitude like this is almost impossible to work with.

Again, in reality, it is not impossible and works well enough all over the world.

> It is ultimately a rather selfish lifestyle.

In response to a post about US workers being among the most stressed in the world, you're suggesting that alternative strategies are "selfish"?

Disclaimer: not OP and I'm neither American nor South American.

I think that yes really it is. I agree with the many people in this thread that say Americans are way over the top with rushing and stressing out over things and putting unreasonable demands on themselves and others.

That said I completely agree that no its not fine for a regular bus driver to just stop and take his lunch and chat with friends just because he feels like it. That's would be what I agree is "this attitude" and selfish.

However, in this particular case we might be talking Greyhound style long distance service and it might just be how this service route is planned out and everyone knows. Then it's fine.

Context matters I would say.

Made up example: your company has a rule to end all meetings 5 minutes before the scheduled end (for real, not just a fake rule to 'make people feel less stressed'). In this company, if you are late to your next meeting you better have a good explanation.

Next company over no such rule exists and higher up regularly end their meetings late. Don't even expect me to make up an excuse when I come 5 minutes late to the next meeting.

Why do big things need to be done?

Also, it's not like the US is doing a good job at getting big things done. 30 years for 50 miles of Seattle-area subway?

> Why do big things need to be done?

I dunno, maybe like improving the quality of life for everyone on this planet?

If you think things like this [0] will happen without "big things" getting done, you're mistaken.

[0] https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/world-population-in-extre...

Your comment is making me want to puke.

Given how late most projects, especially infrastructure projects, are in the US, I’m not sure we can give folks a lesson on that.

A route like that presumably doesn't run on a tight arrival time. The departure time will be set, but arrival time varies according to weather, traffic, road conditions and so on.

You certainly wouldn't book any kind of meeting based on the expected arrival time, a healthy amount of buffer time would need to be calculated in, and that just gives you time to go to a local cafe before your meeting.

Far from the norm but in Boston during the morning rush hour, I once had a driver pull over suddenly, exclaim "back in a minute folks!", and rush off the running bus into a restaurant. I think we all figured he had to hit the bathroom and most of us got a good chuckle out of it. When ya gotta go, right?

> I can only imagine if a driver did that here in Seattle with 30+ people all trying to get somewhere.

I live on the East Coast and had a transit reverse commute for many years. I frequently rode an express bus in the evening on its last return journey from a suburb to the city, and was often the only rider. One day, the driver asked if I'd mind if he made a brief stop for a lotto ticket. I had no problem, so I said "sure". He was able return the favor one night when I was in a hurry but had to stop for groceries. He waited 15 minutes for me to grab some essentials. We got to know each other pretty well over the 18 months I rode the bus and made more than a few other stops as needed along the way.

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