Comment by 3pt14159 | Hacker News Reader

Comment by 3pt14159 | Hacker News Reader

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That is what I believe you believe and I understand where it is coming from. I've managed juniors and I know they make mistakes.

That said, if a junior brings up a question like "why does this error for some tests, but not others?"

    records = some_orm_thing()
    some_model_ids, other_ids = map(list, zip(*records))

The answer is obvious. Some tests return no records for the ORM thing and that doesn't unpack. If you ask this type of question it makes you look bad. I'm not saying it's the end of the world or anything, but we should at least be realistic about how juniors are treated. A private, friendly slack message is much less likely to get them fired than a post in a channel or pull request.

My wording was maybe a little strong, I did try and clarify a bit in another comment below but, I was maybe a little bit unclear and think I might not have fully understood the point you were making. I admit, I did take it as juniors should just shut up, which i admit probably wasn't the most good faith way to interpret it.

I agree there's a difference between the kind of question like the one above vs. something like 'Why isn't there a check in there before unpacking a record?'

The first question is basically 'Teach me stuff I should know' the second is more along the lines of 'Why do we do it this way?'

And there does come a limit, if after a month they're still asking the same questions, not really seeming to have learned anything, it's probably not going to change.

I dunno, really I guess it usually comes down to the person and I hate to say it but, how annoying I find the questions and the person's behaviour.

I'm really happy you responded because I fully agree with you.

I think my larger point was that smart juniors should seek to get clarification privately after exhausting their own skill, but you're absolutely right that they should raise issues as they come up in a thoughtful way to accelerate the team and their own growth.

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