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Comment by josho | Hacker News Reader

I’m curious to learn why people buy these things.

Crime rate where I live is low. Regardless that’s what insurance is for. And I’m not even sure if the doorbell would deter anyone.

Even in a large house I don’t mind coming to the front door to answer the rare unexpected visitor.

That leaves keeping delivery people honest and not throwing deliveries. But again I haven’t had that problem and if I did that’s what the return process is for.

Are these the reasons and I’m just clearly not the target market. If so how are you different that it’s an important purchase to make?

Thanks for sharing your perspectives.

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I have a video doorbell for three reasons:

1. Because I want to know when a delivery occurs so I can promptly retrieve the package.

Most of the time delivery staff don't ring/knock or I may not hear in my office, a simple motion detection camera would do this just as well, but a combined device is simply more convenient.

2. To record who enters and leaves my house and when.

Whether it's friends visiting or a home invader, it's important that I have a record of this in case I find myself in a situation where I need this evidence in the future. For better or for worse (and I think for the worse), the mere existence of these devices means lacking this evidence can be incriminating against yourself, so having evidence to support your own case in the future is simply prudent.

3. So I can respond to people without needing to open the door.

There are all sorts of solicitors and others who go around ringing doorbells, and in general I don't want to speak to them at all, but I also find it more expedient to respond. By doing so through the doorbell I don't have to open the door and expose myself to forced entry risk (which unfortunately is commonplace).

The funny thing about insurance is, that there's no insurance that reasonably covers your packages once a confirmed delivery has been made but prior to you retrieving it, and there is also no insurance that covers the results of a home invasion or incorrect (possibly malicious) prosecution, other than possibly replacing non-unique property (after deductible). An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

I like your answer best so far. You have perfectly reasonable uses for the camera, and none just so happen to overlap with things I care about. I'm clearly not the target market.

I did find your third point on solicitors rather interesting. I get so few that often I'm curious to see who is out and about (maybe 1 every 6 months).

"Regardless that’s what insurance is for."

Wot?!? It appears you've never experienced the feeling that someone was in your house, your bedroom and went through your stuff - perhaps even while you were home... Money cannot fix everything. It can help, but the creepy feeling that your home is no longer private cannot be repaired...

As someone who was burglarized a few years ago, the things that could be replaced was the worst of my worries. My safe deposit box that had notes and sentimental gifts from people that have passed away were taken. My home had been invaded and my sense of security was gone. I couldn't sleep there for weeks and ended up moving shortly after

That's very unfortunate, I'm sorry.

I am not sure though, if a video doorbell would have prevented the break-in. (I am not in the US and I know no one with a video doorbell).

In Texas, we say that feeling is what guns and dogs are for. (note: if you go too far down the rabbit hole on the former, the government may impolitely take care of the latter.)

That's a path with no end, with one security gadget begetting another. Today it's video doorbells, then some CCTV, maybe hidden cameras in every room, and eventually laser trip wires and touch sensors.

You're probably better off looking for the root cause of why you've got that creepy feeling in the first place.

>You're probably better off looking for the root cause of why you've got that creepy feeling in the first place.

I think because someone broke into their house?

My house was broken into about 10 years ago, and I don't have this feeling. Meanwhile, I know someone who does have this feeling and hasn't been burgled. So, the two don't necessarily correlate.

In general, the perception of crime rates are often very out of sync with actual crime rates.

Totally agree. Had a couple of local drunkards come through an unlocked window to steal things years ago and could never shake the creepy factor. Broke the lease and moved early a couple weeks later.

Yes, that sucks. I agree. But, the video doorbell doesn't help with drunks coming in a side/basement window. I understand an array of cameras around the house to cover your example. So, maybe the doorbell video is just one part of the solution--that makes sense. Only having a doorbell video to my earlier question doesn't seem to provide any value.

True, but I want to add that step 1 is lock the windows and doors. No single solution is a cover-all. We have to start with the most basic things, which are usually already installed (locks, blinds, etc).

You are right. I haven’t. I did have my car broken into and the police shared with me the tactics that criminals use and a door bell camera or even cameras wouldn’t deter the pros. And the ones that aren’t pros I wonder if they are too stupid to even notice a doorbell camera.

... or experienced the fine print and hassel of dealing with insurance. Plus, some things can't be replaced. Not to mention, this attitude can lead to higher premiums.

I would never have one but I think it makes people feel control in a world they have little. One thing people need to remember is that if it is easy for you to view your door step or (worse) house interior, it will be easy for someone else to view that info too. IoT companies are notoriously crap at security (because good security is not convenient). Look at all the hacked baby monitors. Now you add in that anything you buy comes with the ability for the parent company to view that video or give it to the police. People want to "keep an eye" on their house but they miss the collective point that then everyone is watching what you are doing all the time. The next product will be made is video motion lights. When the lights come in, it will start recording. Only after people get caught on camera doing something they wouldn't want recorded will they cry "Privacy!". I don't want to live in 1984 but unfortunately a lot of people feel safer with big brother.

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Ben Franklin (yeah, I know this quote is misused but it has been co-opted into a new meaning that is relevant)

> The next product will be made is video motion lights.

Do you mean something like the Nest Cam with floodlight?

https://store.google.com/us/product/nest_cam_floodlight

See, I predicted it!! Clearly I don't follow developments in this space, lol.

I setup a CC camera system around my house to cover all of the entrances.

I’m not purely worried about a break in. It’s a peace of mind thing when something weird happens outside your house, you can find out what it was without having to worry.

Small and simple example: one morning my wife went to leave for work and the side door was open to her minivan. We’ve had cars broken into before when traveling and this definitely put us on alert. We had to check and see what was missing, wonder how they got in, wonder if the car was safe to drive or if they’d taken the garage door opener.

Then we checked the cameras and the door opened by itself about 30 minutes before she walked outside. One of us must have bumped the keys in our pockets. :)

Seeing that on video took something that would have had us worried into something that was no longer a big deal.

Yes great story. I understand the benefit of putting cameras around the perimiter.

Personally I have other projects to tackle first, but could see myself doing that one day. Thank you for the example.

Same reason I bought a dashcam. "That's what insurance is for" is a LOT easier when you have some kind of video evidence of what happened.

Anecdotal but investigative effort and interest from local police departments feels like it's at an all time low for low level crime like vandalism, package theft, etc. Not really passing judgement, perhaps those departments simply have more important things to do for society, but we might as well fill the gap with technology for now.

Yes, whenever I see a dash cam I stop and think about getting one, I see the value. Especially since the probability of a car accident is far more likely than a B&E through your front door.

I work from home and also live in a neighborhood with lots of door to door salesmen. I use a video doorbell to prevent hopping off a meeting just to tell someone I don’t need new windows.

It’s also useful if we are out of town and need a neighbor to grab a delivery.

"And I’m not even sure if the doorbell would deter anyone."

It's the old there's a bear chasing you and another person - you don't have to be faster than the bear, just faster than the other person.

Many criminals avoid houses with cameras, dogs, security systems, etc. Why go to the extra trouble of dealing with the defenses when some other house doesn't have any? Low hanging fruit...

They aren't even that good. We (unfortunately) have an Amazon doorbell and all it does is play wind chimes constantly as dog walkers go past. On top of that, the one time we had a suspicious person approach our door it didn't even record them, we were left wondering what this guy with a bunch of flowers was doing kneeling down at our lock.

Also I find it hilarious that Amazon deliveries don't even ring the doorbell, they just knock the door, drop the package on the door step, and vanish before you even unlock the door.

Oh, and as for why we got it, some scrote put a brick through our porch door and tried to put one through our front window. We hoped if they tried it again we would capture their face, but we all know criminals wear a uniform that hides identifying features.

Personally I also like to know when packages are delivered. Especially because sometimes delivery people ignore instructions and leave the package in a very visible location which makes it prone to theft. I also appreciate having this when I am out of the house in case someone comes to the door so I have the ability to respond as needed.

> Crime rate where I live is low. Regardless that’s what insurance is for. And I’m not even sure if the doorbell would deter anyone.

I appreciate your honesty, but whoa is this a loaded comment. A few things to note:

- Crime is deterred greatly by the probability of getting caught. If a criminal were to see that video is constantly be recorder it would likely lessen the chance of crime happening. In theory your crime rate in your neighbor could be low due to other people having this security on their houses (and thus providing an overall deterrent of "this is a bad place to try to burglarize someone because there are cameras everywhere!")

- Insurance premiums are tied to probabilities of crime. Often times insurance companies will offer discounts if you have security mechanisms. Also, lets say someone does burglarize your house, your insurance premiums will go up in the future.

- Lastly and probably the most simple. Why on earth would you ever want to simply rely on insurance as a remediation to your possessions? Can you replace that unique piece of art with money? What if you were injured by a burglar? etc. etc.

Crime rate where I live is incredibly high.

- The people committing the crimes frequently have untreated mental illness or addictions, and do not care about getting caught.

- Even if you have video and/or proof, they will not be prosecuted. If you have, for example, Find my iPhone, the police will not help you retrieve it even if you have high resolution images of the thief and GPS coordinates and can remotely trigger a loud noise on it.

- Insurance premiums are already insanely high regardless.

> I’m curious to learn why people buy these things.

Psychological coddling. The same reason people put take over their webcams, even though an attacker than has remote code execution on your machine to access it can already steal all your files, records audio and otherwise own you.

Aside from the reason why anyone uses security cameras, they're popular because they're the least disruptive to your home aesthetic. (ie. no wires or obvious cameras at your roofline).

I use mine to keep track of when packages arrive AND to see what my dogs are barking at without having to leave my office. So far it has proven to be a useful tool.

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